My introduction

[PAISWoman]

Hello everyone,

Rather than make this a long post, I give a short introduction.

Every since childhood, I knew there was something different about me. I was teased on a daily basis at school because I was very feminine looking. As a child this was very confusing to me. I didn't know what to think. Was I gay? Was I girl trapped in a boy's body? I just didn't know. Yet, I knew that there was something going on that wasn't being acknowledged.

By the time I reached puberty, I began to express my concerns to my doctors. I was tall and skinny. I had real bad ache. Yet, I still had a very feminine appearance. I wasn't developing any body hair. I would look at other boys and see how they were developing and I couldn't stand up to them. All I had to show was that I was tall and skinny with bad acne. By the time I was 18 yrs old, I dropped out of High School. My cousins were fully developed males with muscles and facial hair. I remember crying to one of cousin as I explained to him that I felt something was wrong. Why I didn't have body hair? Why was I so skinny? My acne had cleared but I still was so skinny. My cousin gave me the advice to start lifting weights. I did for a little while.

It was also during this time that I began to suffer from major headaches. Sometimes I would get nose bleeds. Sometimes, I would vomit. Nothing but sleeping it off would help. My family physician ordered a CT of my cranium to make sure that I didn't have a brain tumor. They couldn't find anything and just dismissed the causes of these headaches as stress related headaches. No further tests were done. No medication administered. These headaches began at the age of 10 years old and I still suffer from them every month to this day.

By the age of 21yrs old, my body was still very feminine looking. Although my shoulders had broadened, Living as a man was painful and depressing. I wanted to be what everyone was saying I was supposed to be. But girls found me unattractive because of my feminine features. Boys thought I was just another homosexual and didn't want to socialize with me. My attraction towards men grew ever so strong and I tried to have same sex relationships. However, things just weren’t the same. I never saw myself as a man and didn't want to be treated like a man. I just wanted to make my family and society happy. I didn't want to be the outcast. Sadly, the story turns bad here. I don't want to discuss what happened in my life during my early to mid twenties because it's period of my life that I'm not very proud of.

By the age of 26yrs old, I had been on and off estrogen for 4 years. I had also started living my life as a woman. Now it was time for me to get my life back on tract from a major setback in life. My family at this point had disowned me with the exception of my mother. I learned to stop looking for love and acceptance in the wrong places from the wrong people through sexual acts. I went to school and graduated with a diploma in Medical Assisting. Work was difficult to find and keep. So, I decided that I needed to go to college.

By the age of 30yrs old, I finally had a physician willing to hear my story. I had to lie to her in order for her to order test. A CT exam, chromosomal test, Androgen test and lots of other test were ordered. The CT results were the only results she would discuss with me. I'm not sure why she wouldn't discuss the results. But I demanded a copy of the CT exam result.

There is soft tissue noted within the perennial region correlating with the area where the vaginal tissue is expected. Prostate or seminal vesicles are not identified. The uterus and adnexa are not present.

Conclusion:

Findings consistent with testicular feminization syndrome or other developmental hormonal abnormalities.

My physician immediately scheduled a follow up exam with a specialist in intersexed conditions. However, he does not work with adults and asked me how come this was not discovered when I was a child. My physician told me that I have all the clear signs of PAIS. I have only strands of facial hair on my chin. I have a few hairs on my upper lip however, nothing to grow a full mustache. My underarm hair is so few you can count how many strands I have. My pubic hair is shaped like an upside down triangle. I'm also not very hairy in the region as well.

The androgen test showed that I did have some resistance to testosterone. But she would not go any further in detail with me. She explained to me that the headaches I get each month are due to my hormonal abnormalities. Since I've had a bilateral orchidectomy, I don't get headaches anymore unless I take an estrogen pill. I now only take my estrogen pills when I feel like I should be taking them and can tolerate the headaches that would result from taking them. My doctor has me on the lowest dose she can prescribe.

Today, I live an AIS woman and have graduated college. I'm now studying for my graduate degree in marketing management. Life is still hard for me. My family does not except the diagnosis the doctors have given me. I've even showed them the CT exam results. They feel as though I should live my life out as a man and stay in misery because that is GOD's will for me. I've chosen to live my life in peace with or without them. I'm happy to be an AIS woman. I plan on having SRS done as soon as I can find a job that will provide me with an income to live and save. Currently, I've only been able to find part time jobs that only want to pay me $10 hour with no medical benefits. I pray that GOD will bless me someday to finally say to myself that I'm complete.

[Kailana]

I understand it's not so easy, feeling like you didn't fit in. That I think is one of those many things that society needs to learn to accept.

sort of like the medical community knows we exist, but they have spent so long destroying us, hiding us, that people; the everyday people just don't have the knowledge that they should have, too understand we are people too.

Sorry to hear about the family as well. It's difficult knowing a family member or whole families, can turn there back and walk away from one of their own. I honestly think, that is also one of the main problems with how intersexed people have been treated by the medical community. Parents, brothers and sisters can all make the same horrendous bigoted choices about acceptance, because they are not informed about medical conditions/genetic variations that have a huge impact on how a person will develope and identify.

Thank you for sharing your brief history and welcome to BodiesLikeOurs.

[PAISWoman]

Thank you for your reply. I haven't been able to respond because there is rule that you must have at least 5 post before you can contribute to any of the conversations on the messeage board. I had to start at least 5 post just to respond to any conversations even the one's that I created.

But, anyway, thank you. I look forward to making this my home since I can't find any active IS groups in my area or on the internet. I find plenty of TS chat rooms, message boards and the like but hardly any for IS persons. I hope that I can be of help to others as well as gain information from others who have gone before me.

Thanks,

[Kailana]

you should of been able to respond to any of the posts. Maybe the server was just on the glitch, ie gremlins, acting buggy. Usually anyone can post comments to a thread, as long as they log in to the server. You know top right corner, if it says Log In, or not logged in, then you are just recognised as a guest and can't post comments or responses.

[fraulein_Maria]

[QUOTE=PAISWoman;15036]Hello everyone,

Rather than make this a long post, I give a short introduction.

I had real bad acne.

>>> seems like the only tissue sensitve to test. was your skin. :( <<<


It was also during this time that I began to suffer from major headaches.

>>> because until you had your orchidectomy, you were pumping out sooo much test. you couldn't use (except to turn some of it into estrogen). <<<

I still suffer from them every month to this day.
She explained to me that the headaches I get each month are due to my hormonal abnormalities. Since I've had a bilateral orchidectomy, I don't get headaches anymore unless I take an estrogen pill. I now only take my estrogen pills when I feel like I should be taking them and can tolerate the headaches that would result from taking them. My doctor has me on the lowest dose she can prescribe.

>>> pills suck. particularly if there premarin. please go on the patch instead.

the head-aches will disappear, you can lower the dosage and still get good effect (because half of it is not being wasted by your liver) its closer to human estrogen than horse estrogen is and besides.....

ever see a horse with tits? <<<

I'm happy to be an AIS woman. I plan on having SRS done

>>> your not the only partial to need SRS as an adult. there's one that i know personally... John Money wrote about her in his books. Just please don't call it "transitioning".....

your initial assignment was wrong. that's why your seeking reassignment. You are not damaging a perfectly healthy body, you are fixing broken one.

Please understand (and please stay) that this is why (among other reasons) C-AIS'ers especially and other IS'ers too, have a hard time with transexuals...

a transexual BY DEFINITION starts out with a perfectly healthy body... a body that any of us here would be grateful to have. They throw it away, and experience a level of envy and jealousy of US that can be quite malicious... which would be fine if they just stayed out of our locker room.

trixie has not been with us long. only long enough to see the damage done... not long enough to see the grey areas.

I believe you.

i don't believe "confused". You have my compassion. "confused" can find someplace else to collect his "troll points" for disrupting a group from his troll friends.

While its possible i'm wrong, i think that between my education (just a few credits shy of my RN) and experience (i have 20+ years in healthcare for the MI/MR/DD population... which some forms of IS falls under) and volunteer work (crisis hotline) i'm not simply confident... i'm REASONABLY confident.

Is it possible that you are the 'poser and he is not? sure. But lets apply Occam's Razor here. In fact, those of us who've been here awhile, do.

You are hurting. Well, you've come into a room of hurting people. Extend the compassion you desire, and chances are, folks will come around.

Its what i did.

i remember the days when my story was doubted. I was told by someone that i was nearly kicked.

that info is second hand, so i can't be positive that it's so, but i have to admit that as an ADD'er, i often miss social cues... perhaps even in writing, though certainly less so.

i just know that the solution to doubt, is not taking offense... and then giving offense. its acknowleging a person's right to doubt... because none of us is in another person's head.

If a stranger knocked on your door and claimed to be a long lost relative, i hope you would ask for some ID before you let them in the door...

Any sensibly raised woman knows that the person knocking, even if they are dressed in clerical garb.... may in fact be someone whose sole intent is to rape and or rob.

this lockeroom is no different.

i read someone claim that this site is like an open air forum...

that person was a newbie.... because we are patently NOT open, and this is for the protection of those within. And that protection is available to YOU and them whether they are conscious of it or not.

[Bryluen]

Welcome. I am glad that that you have a great inner core of strength. "I've chosen to live my life in peace with or without them. I'm happy to be an AIS woman." It is not easy to stand up and be proud of who we are. Love from another AIS Woman.

[Trixie]

PAISWoman -- after reading Maria's post which made a lot of sense, I've decided to extend to you an olive branch. I'm going out on a limb and saying, "yes, I believe you." So before reading on, first and foremost understand those two points.

With that said however, I want to explain to you my feelings and reasoning for two reasons, first to explain myself and second for you to understand my perspective which tends to be pretty common among AIS'ers and maybe in the understanding you will see why not only did I treat you a certain way but also prepare you for others who undoubtedly will as well.

To me, your story sounded very much like many others I've heard before from transsexual ladies who try to claim an IS condition as a way to justify their transition. Who's stories from a medical perspective seem to have many holes in them and simply don't add up. Again, don't take that the wrong way, I'm not saying I don't believe you, I'm simply saying that it sounded like ones I've heard before, each time feeling hurt by their belittlement of our struggle. That is the main reason I felt doubt. Remember that many people in my position have been burned so many times in the past that it's very hard to trust. As well, like so many other women who have had some form of sexual harassment, abuse and/or assault in their past I too have experienced that which again only strengthens the feelings of extreme caution. I understand that you have faced prejudice because of your build and femininity, but I don't think you'll truly understand how women are treated in our society in general until you "transition" (your words).

Personally, it was very hard for me when I found out that I could never carry and give birth to a child of my own. I was only 14 at the time and if that weren't enough, learning about my condition only made me question my sexual orientation even more. While I've always only been attracted to other women, I then started questioning myself thinking that maybe I was attracted to other women because I was supposed to be a man. I know I didn't feel like a man and had no problem with my gender, but I also didn't understand at that age why I wasn't attracted to boys like my friends were.

Personally, every woman or man I've ever met with AIS (CAIS, PAIS, MAIS) has been sterile. As much as I'd like to be a bigger person emotionally, I always have feelings of jealousy when I see a pregnant women, a women who can give birth but chooses not to, or a transsexual woman who fathered a child and then says we’re the same. It has been very hard for me, even when my own partner gave birth to our children I felt extreme jealousy. Honestly, I know that I should be a bigger person and just be happy for other people, and honestly I am trying, it is very hard however.

Again, not doubting you, because people who are MAIS (mild androgen insensitivity syndrome, grade 1) can very well be fertile and often are. This is the reason I asked you if you experienced gynecomastia during puberty, because that is usually the reason someone with MAIS finds out about their condition. It's perfectly normal for someone with MAIS to have normal body hair which is why while I didn't doubt your lack of body hair, it just didn't necessarily point to an IS condition. If anything, the fact that you wrote that you were tall and skinny with relatively small testicles, made me think you may have Klinefelters, not an AIS condition. The acne, also didn't make sense because that is an indication that the testosterone was working not the other way around.

I know at this point, I've got diarrhea of the mouth but I want you to understand my perspective because I am certain it will not be the first time you come across it and maybe the next time you'll be better prepared for your own good. Try not to use so many transsexual terms like transition and SRS, they just throw up warning flags to folks like myself.

You probably should also try to get hold of Lynell Stephani Long, she was raised as a man as well. Someone in the circle can give you her email.

So as I said at the beginning of this post, I'm extending an olive branch and saying, "I believe you,” just please don’t make me regret this.

Emily

[fraulein_Maria]

[QUOTE=Trixie;15545]PAISWoman -- after reading Maria's post which made a lot of sense, I've decided to extend to you an olive branch. I'm going out on a limb and saying, "yes, I believe you."

>>> I'm proud of you. I know how hard that was. Do you doubt that i have CAH? You've seen my pic. I don't have a beard. Or even 5 O'clock shadow. For 30 Long Years i endured every smptom of CAH except the one that no one ever told me was diffinitive... facial hair. :doh:

I must have seemed to be an incredible phony. Had anyone bothered to tell me what they were looking for as a main symptom (and why) i would have laughed myself silly as i showed them pictures of my BROTHERS.....

2 of whom have NO FACIAL HAIR WHATSOEVER.

Because (ready to laugh?) we are of native american ancestry. Ever see an american indian with a beard? our word for white people is "hair mouth".

Why don't native americans (even the MEN) have beards?

Because like most asiatics..... the men and women have few ANDROGEN RECEPTORS in the beard region.... in essense, we are ANDROGEN INSENSITIVE in that one part of our bodies!

I crack up whenever i think about it.... now that i've been in treatment for 2 years... it wasn't funny when i first found out...

I was enraged.

So, my first baby had to die because the racist medical establishment ignored ALL the other symptoms? So i was not, am not, angry at laymen (even educated ones, like yourself) for doubting me. If even the pro's could not get past my face, how can i expect anyone else to?

BTW, they ignored the MUSTASCHE. go figure. not facial enough for anyone. Ignored andrenache at 8 y/o.

BTW, "normal" first sign of puberty (andrenarche) in girls is NOT breast development... its BO, followed by Pubic Hair, Accillary Hair, then Body Hair. Breast develpment usually FOLLOWS Mestruation, not the other way around..... and that's how many Late Dx'ed AIS'ers are "caught".....there bust develops but the menses that usually preceed it by only a year seem late. mom (who is paying attention to this) realizes that men have been buzzing about her girl for 2 years now and still no menses... its time to take her to the gyn to find out why.

So its no surprise to me since XY'ers (both those that become men and those that become women) have andrenarche FIRST, that a partial would notice some pubic hair before any breast development while a complete would not. I suspect that the MAIS crew are also getting body hair before any breast development also.
Remember, complete AIS'ers are actually producing TONS of t. since they are totally insensate, they convert it to TONS of e. = big boobs
Partial's will produce Less t. than you.... and correspondingly, convert less to e. = less (if any) breast development... since there own t. acts as an ANTI-ESTROGEN..... Testosterone is what causes most XX-CAH gals to be embarrassingly flat-chested.
Its also what's used to treat women with breast cancer, to surpress the growth of breast tissue. <<<


this So before reading on, first and foremost understand those two points.

To me, your story sounded very much like many others I've heard before from transsexual ladies who try to claim an IS condition as a way to justify their transition. Who's stories from a medical perspective seem to have many holes in them and simply don't add up.

>>> actually, i can sniff the testosterone faster than that ;) Some wanna-be's have been to the AIS sites and memorized the AIS story... so i'm MORE suspicious of someone whose story seems "perfect". What tips there hand every time though..... (should i say this in public?) I'll PM it. suffice to say i haven't seen it in PAISwoman, but i've seen TONS of it in "confused'.
And also remember that most people with any IS condition are LAY PEOPLE... that means that they do not know how to describe there conditions in a way that is logical to medico's, or educated lay people like yourself. When i do intake? I'm not done when my form is filled out... i'm just done for the day. they do not know what is, and what is not, significant to a sharp medico.

Did you know that i can tell a person's medical history by just looking at there hands? i'm often glad that lay people don't know what to look for. They would use that LITTLE knowlege to hurt innocent people, instead of bothering to learn everything else. <<<

I understand that you have faced prejudice because of your build and femininity, but I don't think you'll truly understand how women are treated in our society in general until you "transition" (your words).

>>> that's true. he doesn't. he knows something WORSE.

Women are raped. Beaten. Cowed until every hint of masculinity is covered up or glossed over. And yet, a masculinized female gains some respect. I AM ONE, YOUR NOT.

"Effeminate" males on the other hand.....

there LIVES are endangered EVERYWHERE. Dykes like me are seldom killed. Dykes like you NEVER are. fella's like he was are KILLED EVERY DAY.

Wanna step into the shoes s/he once wore? Pack. stuff a sock into your jeans......

But your girlfriend had better be ready to die for you that day. And you'd best be packin a heater if you don't want her to.

unless you live in "Live and Let Live" New England :) Moving north was the best thing that ever happened to me. <<<

I was only 14 at the time and if that weren't enough, learning about my condition only made me question my sexual orientation even more.

>>> you know, i think y'all should be told either BEFORE puberty or AFTER for this very reason.....

I didn't find out i had a Y chromosome at 14..... I just had my first sex dream @<hidden> I remember going to bed a child, and waking up believing firmly that satan had entered my loins. I was overcome with the urge to fuck ANYTHING that moved... and many things that didn't.... ALL the time. Love had nothing to do with it. in fact, it was often simultanious with the urge to choke to death with my bare hands the person making me feel that way.

I wasn't psychotic. I was experiencing a "normal" male andrenarche.

Scarey isn't it? I didn't have a dad to tell me "its ok son, we all feel that way at your age. you've got to learn to channel that power into something constructive. the electricity has to go SOMEWHERE or you'll fry from the inside out".

What i had was a dad, a mom, and a society that said i was a hoe with a one way ticket to hell.

And to top it off..... @<hidden> i finally fall in love... with a woman. With a feminity i had been studiously taught to despise.

I was DOOMED.

later on in years, i become pregnant (long story) and trembled with fear because most of my female relatives had mysteriously lost there first child. But unlike them, i had reason to doubt myself. And when my baby died, it was the last nail in my esteem's coffin.....

the simplest thing a XX woman can do (they usually have to go to great lengths to NOT have babies) and I CAN'T EVEN DO THIS RIGHT. i spent the next 7 years in a daze..... because poor single women aren't supposed to morn there dead children... there supposed to be GRATEFUL to not be burdened.
I did spend a short period of time doing the drag king thing... and doing it well. But it never fit my soul. Despite my masculinized body, and brain..... i am as fem in my spirit as any AIS'er looks in her body. It just took time to cast of the mysogyny that kept me from knowing it. <<<

Personally, every woman or man I've ever met with AIS (CAIS, PAIS, MAIS) has been sterile.

>>> having sperm does not make one fertile. While a complete won't have any, i don't see why a partial or an MAIS with decended testes wouldn't. <<

As much as I'd like to be a bigger person emotionally, I always have feelings of jealousy when I see a pregnant women, a women who can give birth but chooses not to

>>> someday you'll realize that pregnancy is dangerous. Sometimes to a woman's life, often to her relationships, and always to her financial well-being. On those rare occassions i voluntarily slept with men, i made sure they wore condoms, and i backed it up with the sponge. Though i was happy to be pregnant at the time, i was poor and alone... thank Godde i was not still a teen! I was scared half to death. I had been a physically strong girl, and then woman.... THEN the arms that had lifted 200+ pounds, could not lift a pail of water. The legs that had run a mile in under 6 min. could now not climb a flight of stairs without being winded.
That's a normal pregnancy. <<<

or a transsexual woman who fathered a child and then says we’re the same.

>>> they're definately not. but i don't believe PAISwoman said anything about fathering. <<<

It has been very hard for me, even when my own partner gave birth to our children I felt extreme jealousy.

>>> she's lucky to have you. just so you know, womb envy is far more common than penis envy <<<

Honestly, I know that I should be a bigger person and just be happy for other people, and honestly I am trying, it is very hard however.

>>> that's cause in the back of your mind you think that if things had been different, you'd be a fertile female. Let me blow that fallacy away.
If things had been different, you'd be just another HO-HUM, expendable, fertile, GUY, cannon fodder, nothing special about you. Probably get your ass shot to hell in Iraq proving your manliness before you made anyone pregnant.

Instead, Godde decided to spare you that indignity. ;)

Instead of an ordinary male, you became an EXTRA-ORDINARY female.

As i've said in "the grass is greener" thread, i'd trade my body for yours in a heart beat.....

I would gladly trade my possibly FATAL condition (its certainly shortened my life by 20 years) with its fertility, for your beauty and longevity. I've never met an AIS'er (and i've met a few) who understood CAH that would take me up on the trade.

Now that we've all had our pity party, lets get back to the work of loving ourselves the way Godde made us, and encouraging others to do the same...

We could all have been born with quadraplegic CP..... Powerful minds trapped in bodies that can't move with any purpose, having dinner poured down a tube through your nose.

I love my clients. They lift my depression every time. <<<

If anything, the fact that you wrote that you were tall and skinny with relatively small testicles, made me think you may have Klinefelters

>>> they're tall? they're skinny? not that i've noticed. ANDRE! chime in here! and last i heard they had pleanty of body hair. <<<

The acne, also didn't make sense because that is an indication that the testosterone was working not the other way around.

Completes are the only ones with no acne (and no BO). the rest of us have to cope with variable amounts of it. <<<

I know at this point, I've got diarrhea of the mouth

>>> no, your just speaking you mind. this is a good thing. <<<

Try not to use so many transsexual terms like transition and SRS, they just throw up warning flags to folks like myself.

>>> i agree with the word "transition". But SRS is what any IS person assigned wrongly must get. Its not there fault the doctors did not wait and messed up. Technically, SRS is what YOU got when you had your orchidectomy, and what i got when i had a clitoral reduction. the dif. is that it happened to us as kids... and that we were assigned correctly... by accident of course. ;) <<<

You probably should also try to get hold of Lynell Stephani Long, she was raised as a man as well. Someone in the circle can give you her email.

>>> she's not the only one. Past pres. of AIS-USA Deborah AKA "Peggy" was also. she lives in New England if you want to meet her. <<<

So as I said at the beginning of this post, I'm extending an olive branch and saying, "I believe you,” just please don’t make me regret this.

Emily

>>> now now. no need to end a positive letter with vailed threats. This is how it works.....

Because its possible i am being deceived, i have also asked myself what is the worst that could happen if i accept this persons story, and it turns out to be false.....

If the falseness is discovered quickly; really, no harm is done. We're adults. a little egg in the face is not fatal.

but what if.....

This person is for real, and in our hardness, turn them away?

Would you like me to tell you of the total disaster that was, when it DID happen? PM if you want to know. <<<

[Trixie]

Maria, I feel that you are taking many of the things I said out of context and making many incorrect assumptions about myself and my knowledge. I am not upset with you in the least, but since I've always found your posts to be sincere you should not assume so many things about me. And for the record, I've read your other posts and have seen your avatar which I can only assume is indeed you, and at no point did I ever feel or think you where a "phony."

If you'd like to explain things to the site in general, that's great, but most of what you discussed was specifically directed at me. I am not CAIS, you are not the only one who's had your clitoris surgically altered, that I have needed in addition to pressure dilation, more surgery, to accomplish "normal" depth, that one of my girlfriends was Native American or that I am part Mongolian (I won't assume that I need to explain to you the similarities), my medical background, you don't know that I myself was raped and almost killed, you don't know that my ex-partner kept our children from me for several years and the court supported her and that I've had to spend every dollar I've made, make and will make on legal expenses just to be a part of our children's lives, and these things are only the tip of the iceberg.

I've been through a lot in my life, it's made me who I am. I know I am a better person for it and without the hardships would not appreciate life the way I do. I wouldn't have been compelled to make helping people my profession and passion. How it gave me a dogged loyalty to the people I know.

I also do not really care what people write about me, they don't know me, I won't lose any sleep over it, won't ruin even a second of my day. You are not the only one who can see a "phony" a mile away, and I am not afraid to step out of bounds at times to protect myself and the others around me while simultaneously putting myself in the line of fire. I do respect you from your posts, I won't assume that I know you or can truly understand your perspective, my post to PAISWoman was an attempt to explain to her my perspective, she's given hers and you've given yours, just don't assume that you mine so well.

Have a nice day (seriously),

Emily

[PAISWoman]

PAISWoman -- after reading Maria's post which made a lot of sense, I've decided to extend to you an olive branch. I'm going out on a limb and saying, "yes, I believe you." So before reading on, first and foremost understand those two points.

With that said however, I want to explain to you my feelings and reasoning for two reasons, first to explain myself and second for you to understand my perspective which tends to be pretty common among AIS'ers and maybe in the understanding you will see why not only did I treat you a certain way but also prepare you for others who undoubtedly will as well.

To me, your story sounded very much like many others I've heard before from transsexual ladies who try to claim an IS condition as a way to justify their transition. Who's stories from a medical perspective seem to have many holes in them and simply don't add up. Again, don't take that the wrong way, I'm not saying I don't believe you, I'm simply saying that it sounded like ones I've heard before, each time feeling hurt by their belittlement of our struggle. That is the main reason I felt doubt. Remember that many people in my position have been burned so many times in the past that it's very hard to trust. As well, like so many other women who have had some form of sexual harassment, abuse and/or assault in their past I too have experienced that which again only strengthens the feelings of extreme caution. I understand that you have faced prejudice because of your build and femininity, but I don't think you'll truly understand how women are treated in our society in general until you "transition" (your words).

Personally, it was very hard for me when I found out that I could never carry and give birth to a child of my own. I was only 14 at the time and if that weren't enough, learning about my condition only made me question my sexual orientation even more. While I've always only been attracted to other women, I then started questioning myself thinking that maybe I was attracted to other women because I was supposed to be a man. I know I didn't feel like a man and had no problem with my gender, but I also didn't understand at that age why I wasn't attracted to boys like my friends were.

Personally, every woman or man I've ever met with AIS (CAIS, PAIS, MAIS) has been sterile. As much as I'd like to be a bigger person emotionally, I always have feelings of jealousy when I see a pregnant women, a women who can give birth but chooses not to, or a transsexual woman who fathered a child and then says we’re the same. It has been very hard for me, even when my own partner gave birth to our children I felt extreme jealousy. Honestly, I know that I should be a bigger person and just be happy for other people, and honestly I am trying, it is very hard however.

Again, not doubting you, because people who are MAIS (mild androgen insensitivity syndrome, grade 1) can very well be fertile and often are. This is the reason I asked you if you experienced gynecomastia during puberty, because that is usually the reason someone with MAIS finds out about their condition. It's perfectly normal for someone with MAIS to have normal body hair which is why while I didn't doubt your lack of body hair, it just didn't necessarily point to an IS condition. If anything, the fact that you wrote that you were tall and skinny with relatively small testicles, made me think you may have Klinefelters, not an AIS condition. The acne, also didn't make sense because that is an indication that the testosterone was working not the other way around.

I know at this point, I've got diarrhea of the mouth but I want you to understand my perspective because I am certain it will not be the first time you come across it and maybe the next time you'll be better prepared for your own good. Try not to use so many transsexual terms like transition and SRS, they just throw up warning flags to folks like myself.

You probably should also try to get hold of Lynell Stephani Long, she was raised as a man as well. Someone in the circle can give you her email.

So as I said at the beginning of this post, I'm extending an olive branch and saying, "I believe you,” just please don’t make me regret this.

Emily

I thank you for giving me this olive branch.

[PAISWoman]

[QUOTE=PAISWoman;15036]Hello everyone,

Rather than make this a long post, I give a short introduction.

I had real bad acne.

>>> seems like the only tissue sensitve to test. was your skin. :( <<<


It was also during this time that I began to suffer from major headaches.

>>> because until you had your orchidectomy, you were pumping out sooo much test. you couldn't use (except to turn some of it into estrogen). <<<

I still suffer from them every month to this day.
She explained to me that the headaches I get each month are due to my hormonal abnormalities. Since I've had a bilateral orchidectomy, I don't get headaches anymore unless I take an estrogen pill. I now only take my estrogen pills when I feel like I should be taking them and can tolerate the headaches that would result from taking them. My doctor has me on the lowest dose she can prescribe.

>>> pills suck. particularly if there premarin. please go on the patch instead.

the head-aches will disappear, you can lower the dosage and still get good effect (because half of it is not being wasted by your liver) its closer to human estrogen than horse estrogen is and besides.....

ever see a horse with tits? <<<

I'm happy to be an AIS woman. I plan on having SRS done

>>> your not the only partial to need SRS as an adult. there's one that i know personally... John Money wrote about her in his books. Just please don't call it "transitioning".....

your initial assignment was wrong. that's why your seeking reassignment. You are not damaging a perfectly healthy body, you are fixing broken one.

Please understand (and please stay) that this is why (among other reasons) C-AIS'ers especially and other IS'ers too, have a hard time with transexuals...

a transexual BY DEFINITION starts out with a perfectly healthy body... a body that any of us here would be grateful to have. They throw it away, and experience a level of envy and jealousy of US that can be quite malicious... which would be fine if they just stayed out of our locker room.

trixie has not been with us long. only long enough to see the damage done... not long enough to see the grey areas.

I believe you.

i don't believe "confused". You have my compassion. "confused" can find someplace else to collect his "troll points" for disrupting a group from his troll friends.

While its possible i'm wrong, i think that between my education (just a few credits shy of my RN) and experience (i have 20+ years in healthcare for the MI/MR/DD population... which some forms of IS falls under) and volunteer work (crisis hotline) i'm not simply confident... i'm REASONABLY confident.

Is it possible that you are the 'poser and he is not? sure. But lets apply Occam's Razor here. In fact, those of us who've been here awhile, do.

You are hurting. Well, you've come into a room of hurting people. Extend the compassion you desire, and chances are, folks will come around.

Its what i did.

i remember the days when my story was doubted. I was told by someone that i was nearly kicked.

that info is second hand, so i can't be positive that it's so, but i have to admit that as an ADD'er, i often miss social cues... perhaps even in writing, though certainly less so.

i just know that the solution to doubt, is not taking offense... and then giving offense. its acknowleging a person's right to doubt... because none of us is in another person's head.

If a stranger knocked on your door and claimed to be a long lost relative, i hope you would ask for some ID before you let them in the door...

Any sensibly raised woman knows that the person knocking, even if they are dressed in clerical garb.... may in fact be someone whose sole intent is to rape and or rob.

this lockeroom is no different.

i read someone claim that this site is like an open air forum...

that person was a newbie.... because we are patently NOT open, and this is for the protection of those within. And that protection is available to YOU and them whether they are conscious of it or not.

Thanks Maria,

I wish i could prove to everyone that I'm not a transsexual just using AIS to justify my reasons for who I am today. I have my medical records and I'm willing to send a copy of my CT exam to anyone who wishes to see. I have nothing to hide.

I apologize for using terms such as SRS, and transitioing because I didn't know what other words to use. I beginning to think of myself in a different perspective now. However, if at anytime anyone doubts what I'm saying, please just ask for me to send the documents. I have no problem sending them to people. In fact, sometimes I can be too revealing of personal information that I sit and wonder why I even posted that online. But in this situation, I don't have a problem proving who I am and who I say I am.

[Kailana]

sorry, as i spent a very long time uploading my scans, CT abd, CT Pelvic, MRI Abdominal for Maria, tookforever by the way. I actually figured it would just be a whole lot easier to mail her copy of my disks, at least that way, she can actually see and also play with all the functions on the programs, you'd be surprised what a body can have inside. Anyways, I would actually love to see your scans. think my emails in my profile, if not its right here.

mishakaila@<hidden> or mishakaila@<hidden> no problems for me giving out showing my email addie, nothing special about it. i dont use the yahoo account much, i generally find sending picts annoying using it. with hotmail i can select a bunch and upload, send together, with yahoo, its uploading one at a time then sending, and you cant see just how big the file is untill you try to send, then its remove picts again and again, resend, and hope it goes through. Yahoo needs a bit more work on ease of use.

I would mention that or ask that "Are you sure you really want to send them, I happen to know, that it is actually very annoying, tedious to send tons of picts online. Might not of been so bad if it was just one set of scans, but as i Have 3 disks, well you know, it just makes for alot of pictures, not to mention the hassle of exporting them off of the programs the hospitals gave me. MRI was easy as i just selected all, but the CT scans were just a pain, i had to label each and every slide, which just made for a real mess. So far though, only Wilfred and Maria have bothered to ask to see them, at least i don't think anyone else has. Can't say that they are all that special, just shows some anatomy, that you really wouldn't expect to see if i was a normal male. As I am not, I sort have a mostly male body by anatomy with a few variations that look surprisingly female. But overall if you actually were to see my build, I just look funny, oddest body/frame phenotype I really just think i am built/developed wierd. i could actually send Pelvic Ultrasound scans as well but those just piss me off. Sorry for rambling, but holler at me if you care to see a predominantly male oddly shaped body with some unusual anatomy that doesnt make any sense, well some of it does, some of it doesn't and I am pretty good at analyzing scans.

[fraulein_Maria]

[QUOTE=PAISWoman;15576][QUOTE=fraulein_Maria;15543]

Thanks Maria,

I wish i could prove to everyone that I'm not a transsexual just using AIS to justify my reasons for who I am today.

>>> you don't have to. like i've been trying to get across to some since i came, i could actually careless if you were or weren't.... what counts is honesty and whether or not you behave like a jerk. remember my metaphor about wanting to see some ID before i'd let you (or any stranger) in my house? well, if you said you are trans and IT said you were trans, my response is :sign16:

its the bullshit i can't stand.

for now, i have no problem taking you at your word because i know your a layperson trying to describe in medical jargon what's up with you. you certainly aren't the first to use less than accurate terms, and you won't be the last..... so its good for the semi-pro's here to learn that.

I have things to learn too. there are folk here who could quote blood levels of hormones that i can't seem to begin to memorize. that's what i have my reference texts for. i think its because i'm generally bad with numbers. there are conditions much rarer than mine (i'm learning everyday about "Turner's Mosaicism" from Kailana) that i can read about, but its just not the same as reading the personal story of someone, instead of the bone dry text. <<<

sadly I have my medical records and I'm willing to send a copy of my CT exam to anyone who wishes to see. I have nothing to hide.

>>> its not only not necessary (unless you want to join the private AIS club) i don't know anyone (confession time! who else?) besides me here who can actually read a CT or an MRI with any accuracy. <<<

I apologize for using terms such as SRS

>>> no. its a perfectly accurate term. Complete AIS'ers (and CAH's) bugged by it can just ask themselves why it bothers them so much. Is it because its used mostly in reference to trans.? or because none of us wants to think of the surgeries we've had as being part of an assignment that could be wrong? Partials are a painful reminder to us of that possibility. <<<

and transitioing

>>> that you can drop like a hot potatoe. it is not medical jargon but a comforting phrase of the trans community. I'm glad it comforts them, but it is misleading. <<<

because I didn't know what other words to use.

>>> which i suspected from the start. <<<

I beginning to think of myself in a different perspective now.

>>> good. :) Hopefully, you will begin to see yourself as a child of Godde, creates thusly on purpose... that your body is not a cruel joke played on you by the almighty... but a challenge to be met that you can grow from. It certainly beats incurable, mostly untreatable, quad CP. <<<

[Kailana]

besides me here who can actually read a CT or an MRI with any accuracy. fraulein_maria.

Ahh personally i think im pretty good, but then i am looking not just at the obvious male/female shape of things, but the actual plumbing wiring of blood vessels, arteries, ducts, all the wet work(plumbing) that goes everywhere, you know, There are lots of things that go along with surgery, not just the shape of a uterus, or the shape of a prostate,or if its removed, i am looking for those obvious things that really take a fair amount of studying to understand isn't normal, and only happens when surgery is performed.

Still though, Pais woman if you have the time and don't mind i would love to take a look.

I apologize for using terms such as SRSPaisWoman

Well I used to use GRS, most Trans used to never know what that was, but GRS was usually used on infants who had surgical assignments, SRS used to be used most often for the trans community, but now well there sort of the same but not. One SRS (Sex Reassignment Surgery)changing the sex of a person, GRS (Gender Reassignment Surgery) assigning a gender. Thats about the only real difference though, typically you only really see the SRS used these days. GRS seems to have lost alot of it's importance in surgical assignment of gender on an ambigous infant. I am sure it still gets used but alot less often.

Oh and I actually like Fraulein_maria's comments about not using TRANS, but it's actually hard not to as honestly that is what alot of people see, as we have talked about it, basically, it's just a bad gender assignment as an infant, meaning some of us were asssigned wrong, that is not our fault, that is the doctors/parents doing, it doesn't make us TRANS though if we are fixing a surgical error doctors/parents made.

[PAISWoman]

[QUOTE=PAISWoman;15576][QUOTE=fraulein_Maria;15543]

Thanks Maria,

I wish i could prove to everyone that I'm not a transsexual just using AIS to justify my reasons for who I am today.

>>> you don't have to. like i've been trying to get across to some since i came, i could actually careless if you were or weren't.... what counts is honesty and whether or not you behave like a jerk. remember my metaphor about wanting to see some ID before i'd let you (or any stranger) in my house? well, if you said you are trans and IT said you were trans, my response is :sign16:

its the bullshit i can't stand.

for now, i have no problem taking you at your word because i know your a layperson trying to describe in medical jargon what's up with you. you certainly aren't the first to use less than accurate terms, and you won't be the last..... so its good for the semi-pro's here to learn that.

I have things to learn too. there are folk here who could quote blood levels of hormones that i can't seem to begin to memorize. that's what i have my reference texts for. i think its because i'm generally bad with numbers. there are conditions much rarer than mine (i'm learning everyday about "Turner's Mosaicism" from Kailana) that i can read about, but its just not the same as reading the personal story of someone, instead of the bone dry text. <<<

sadly I have my medical records and I'm willing to send a copy of my CT exam to anyone who wishes to see. I have nothing to hide.

>>> its not only not necessary (unless you want to join the private AIS club) i don't know anyone (confession time! who else?) besides me here who can actually read a CT or an MRI with any accuracy. <<<

I apologize for using terms such as SRS

>>> no. its a perfectly accurate term. Complete AIS'ers (and CAH's) bugged by it can just ask themselves why it bothers them so much. Is it because its used mostly in reference to trans.? or because none of us wants to think of the surgeries we've had as being part of an assignment that could be wrong? Partials are a painful reminder to us of that possibility. <<<

and transitioing

>>> that you can drop like a hot potatoe. it is not medical jargon but a comforting phrase of the trans community. I'm glad it comforts them, but it is misleading. <<<

because I didn't know what other words to use.

>>> which i suspected from the start. <<<

I beginning to think of myself in a different perspective now.

>>> good. :) Hopefully, you will begin to see yourself as a child of Godde, creates thusly on purpose... that your body is not a cruel joke played on you by the almighty... but a challenge to be met that you can grow from. It certainly beats incurable, mostly untreatable, quad CP. <<<


Thank you,

I'm learning so much from the circle and this group. I have a lot of negative throughts still that I need to get rid of. But, I'm getting there.

I don't have the CT exam slides. I have the CT exam results printed out from my doctors office. She would not give me any more details and would not print out any other test that I had done. She told me, "your chromosome test came back XY and you can continue taking your hormones." When I asked what the result of the other test were, she told me that they weren't important and that she is referring to children's hospital to a physcian that specializes in intersex children. She then pick up the phone and spoke with this doctor over the phone and they set a time and date for me to see him. When she hung up the phone, she asked me, "How come this was not discovered when you were younger?" I told her they ignored me.

Later that week, the specialist called me and spoke with me for about an hour over the phone. He sounded very upset and told me about AIS and what it was and what to do next. He ended his conversation with me by saying that I should have come to him much earlier in my life and that because I was an adult he couldn't see me. That was the end of my discovery and diagnosis. No further information was given to me. Keep in mind that the hospital I had my test done was the hospital I was born in. I'm not sure if they could go back so far in time, but I really would like the result of the all the test they did on me. They wont give it to me saying that it's not important for me to have. I guess if I called my mom's lawyer and he was suing the doctors he could get the information. However, I soon learned that people don't have free access to their medical records as they think they do. Without a court order, I'm not sure I could get the entire record.

[fraulein_Maria]

[QUOTE=Trixie;15566]Maria, for the record, I've read your other posts and have seen your avatar which I can only assume is indeed you, and at no point did I ever feel or think you where a "phony."

>>> actually, that portion of my post had a dual purpose. The first was to let you know that even someone with as much cred as i've earned, didn't start out with any, and justifiably so.

the second was to tease the old-timers who doubted me. i know, its wicked. someone... :whipg: me. LOL. <<<

If you'd like to explain things to the site in general, that's great, but most of what you discussed was specifically directed at me.

>>> nope. your not the only AIS'er here. <<<

I am not CAIS

>>> my apologese. i must have misunderstood you.
I could have sworn that you identified yourself as such, that glass insulted you for being, and that you did not deny it. Lastly, your life story and the treatments you described sounded like C-AIS and i thought you claimed "circle" membership.
So please forgive me for being a little at sea here. <<<

you are not the only one who's had your clitoris surgically altered

>>> true. most of us post in the CAH forum though. <<<

that I have needed in addition to pressure dilation, more surgery, to accomplish "normal" depth, that one of my girlfriends was Native American or that I am part Mongolian (I won't assume that I need to explain to you the similarities), my medical background, you don't know that I myself was raped and almost killed, you don't know that my ex-partner kept our children from me for several years and the court supported her and that I've had to spend every dollar I've made, make and will make on legal expenses just to be a part of our children's lives, and these things are only the tip of the iceberg.

>>> no. i did not know any of these things. you neither said, nor intimated them, so how could i? smart cookie, yes. mind-reader, no.

I'm very sorry about what you've been through. i know about treacherous ex.'s... i don't know about spending all my money on lawyers, only on doctors (and the occassional date with champaign taste on my beer budget ;)

And i know what it is to spend half my life locked up because my test. poisoned brain did not endear me to my family. <<<

You are not the only one who can see a "phony" a mile away

>>> not all of them. the one i was taken in by hacked this site. once burned, twice shy. and then i learned, the subtle (yet profound) difference between IS-Mtf, trans-IS wanna-be's, and real Mtf transexuals... wanna guess which of the 3 is possessed of the nearly unshakable belief, that the world generally (and women specifically) OWES them PERSONALLY something? women raised women, men who don't think, THEY KNOW, that a mistake's been made by the doctors, and real Mtf's KNOW that trust/respect is EARNED..... and that only silly, hormone driven teen-age girls just give it away.

And this (like my other posts) is not said only to you, or even primarily to you. If that were so, i usually write it PM.

THIS IS TO YOU: You've got knowlege. You've got chutzpah. I admire both.

To everybody again: Back to work! :whipg: there's folks out there with less knowlege, less chutzpah, and even thinner skin! ready? :grouphug0

Was that so hard?

[Trixie]

I am not CAIS

>>> my apologese. i must have misunderstood you.
I could have sworn that you identified yourself as such, that glass insulted you for being, and that you did not deny it. Lastly, your life story and the treatments you described sounded like C-AIS and i thought you claimed "circle" membership.
So please forgive me for being a little at sea here. <<<For the record, I am not CAIS, I am PAIS and depending on the scale used, I'm somewhere between a 4 and a 5. I am no longer a member of the circle by choice, but still remain friends with a few.

[george.bush]

By the time I reached puberty, I began to express my concerns to my doctors. I was tall and skinny. I had real bad ache. Yet, I still had a very feminine appearance. I wasn't developing any body hair. I would look at other boys and see how they were developing and I couldn't stand up to them. All I had to show was that I was tall and skinny with bad acne. By the time I was 18 yrs old, I dropped out of High School. My cousins were fully developed males with muscles and facial hair. I remember crying to one of cousin as I explained to him that I felt something was wrong. Why I didn't have body hair? Why was I so skinny? My acne had cleared but I still was so skinny. My cousin gave me the advice to start lifting weights. I did for a little while.:wink_smil