an open letter to the BLO Klinefelters/XXY community

[OkieDokie]

If Nicky (kamododragon) were a nice guy, no one would take notice of his intersex status.

But he is not a nice guy. He likes to pretend he is XXY (he's not), get on XXY forums, and start flamewars on matters to do with intersex. What is going on now in BLO is hardly the first time.

I am not new to the XXY world, just to BLO. I have been an XXY community activist for over a decade. At one time or another I have been an active member of all the XXY internet forums and mailing lists. My name is listed in the credits of the 47xxy.org website, the first website to deal exclusively with XXY information. There are two XXY support organizations in the US; I have served on the Board of Directors of one, and done volunteer work for both. Right now, I am getting involved with a UK support organization. I have worked with doctors, educators, and webmasters, to get bad information taken off websites and out of textbooks. I have run an XXY support group in my city, for XXY adults and parents of XXY children. I spend time on XXY forums looking for the newly diagnosed so I can help them understand their condition.

I am very well informed about all things XXY and I am passionate in my support of the XXY community.

We have enough miserable XXYs in our forums already, without a fraudulent poseur coming in and picking fights with our people.

This isn't about Graeme or Canice or anybody else but Nicky.

When Nicky is gone off BLO, the flamewars in the BLO Klinefelters/XXY forum will stop.

[roguekiwixxy]

I am not new to the XXY world,
I am very well informed about all things XXY and I am passionate in my support of the XXY community.


[quote]
Well, I looked at this one for ages, then I looked some more, then I thought I'd reply.....but I can't think of anything to say.


We have enough miserable XXYs in our forums already, without a fraudulent poseur coming in and picking fights with our people.


Mmmmmmmmmm, miserable?...mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm


Tis a rare event.

[OkieDokie]

The day you can't find anything in one of my posts to quibble with, that day I am going to retire from the XXY community.

hahahahaha

[roguekiwixxy]

The day you can't find anything in one of my posts to quibble with, that day I am going to retire from the XXY community.

hahahahaha

I hate to be cause of your demise, I just can't find anything, sorry.:lol:

[Kailana]

duckslammer i think I finally understand Graeme better. Kinda surprised he didnt give you any real responses to your post.

Thank you for taking the time and investing so much of yourself into raising XXY awareness and understanding. That is a noble achievement.

I would like to say that I wouldn't solo out Nicky so much though, Because he as a person who has been diagnosed as Kahlmans Syndrome, is just going off of what he was told. There is always a possibility that his Dx that he knows of is just what he was told was the reason for why he is and has what he has. You know I honestly think that alot of issues about whether or not someone has a condition and is actually intersexed is actually caused by the amount of information that doctors have chosen to disclose or not disclose with their patients. Not having complete access to all medical records, surgicies, and biopsy reports, often leaves lots of room for missinformation.

As far as nicky goes for me at least, I just hope he learns to stop flaming the Trans community, cause many are perfectly descent people and it is the few looking for acceptance that push the TS as an subset of IS. I happen to actually value his presence, but hope the flaming stops.

Now Graeme, who I liked, I figured out, just likes arguing, If he actually bothered to do a little research on his own instead of reading what he finds other people have posted and took a little incentive to validate his own links, and information he pushes/supports then he might just learn that there is and are more aspects/variations too some intersexed condition's then what he has been lead to believe. Just by investing a little effort he would know, that alot of what he thinks is true, what he understands is true, isn't. There are tons of support groups, medical references, published medical texts and books out, that do not include many variations within there data, because that data breaks away from accepted doctrine. It dissproves what is being pushed as accepted information for a condition, and that alone proves/shows just how much missinformation is actually being pushed onto people because of bigotry/discrimination. It is an amazing thing to witness, someone pushing just how much information they know, how much knowledge they have, someone pushing just how much work they do to promote intersexed issues and then to see them so closed off, so single minded, that is actually shows just how much they do not know about intersexed issues.
"Sorry about that duckslammer, didn't mean to intrude on your thread"

Anyways, thank you for sharing, oh and by the way the flame wars are allover the place, at the moment, and I am trying very hard to understand why so much has been pushed around within the last few months. BLO is and always has been a forum for intersexed issues, intersexed rights, intersexed activism, intersexed knowledge, intersexed personal histories all available to help other intersexed people understand and learn from one another.

Flame wars? its little kids argueing over nothing. I actually am waiting for the forums to straigten out you know, cause right now, there is crap just thrown all over the place. eventually the air will clear and the BLO forum will get back to more important things then calling people names. Maybe just maybe a few of the members will learn something in the meantime and just come to understand that there are always arguments and disbutes in every forum, they happen, but they shouldn't ruin a forum. BLO exists because people find it usefull. BLO exists because many of us do find alot of help and insight into understanding ourselves better. BLO exists cause there is a need for a place that is safe from having people edit what is actually said when it comes to real intersexed issues. Many intersexed support groups do not share the openness that BLO has. Here at least we have some say about what is said, there are rules, and Peter does a real good job overseeing things. But flaming people isnt something this forum needs. I personally could care less if someone is a poser or not, as long as they at least have enough common sense to respect everyone else then there really shouldnt be any issues. Cause honestly, what I have read and scene the most lately, and thats within the last 2-3 months is that the people who appear to be the real posers are the ones claiming other people are posers. spelling errors intentionally left in to clarify that a poser is a person who is not real.

[OkieDokie]

Don't try to figure Graeme out. Just when you think you understand him, he'll throw you a curve ball.

If he gets on your nerves, just say "you could be right!" :) :) :) :)

[roguekiwixxy]

Don't try to figure Graeme out. Just when you think you understand him, he'll throw you a curve ball.

If he gets on your nerves, just say "you could be right!" :) :) :) :)

Wots a 'curve ball', my balls a oval, well they used to be anyway, but my prostheses definitely are.:bounce:

[OkieDokie]

Curve ball is a baseball term - another american invention! A curve ball is thrown by a pitcher to the batter in such a way that it doesn't fly in a straight line. A curve ball will confuse the batter because he doesn't know quite where/when to hit it and will often miss.

"To throw a curve ball" means the same as "to throw a curve"

[roguekiwixxy]

Curve ball is a baseball term - another american invention! A curve ball is thrown by a pitcher to the batter in such a way that it doesn't fly in a straight line. A curve ball will confuse the batter because he doesn't know quite where/when to hit it and will often miss.

"To throw a curve ball" means the same as "to throw a curve"

:bounce: Ta, doesn't that bouncy green thing make you feel squeemish?

[peaceandparty]

ok ......

i heard about this through the grapevine!

now i read that its you duckslammer who likes to slam doors shut in peoples faces!

nick and duckslammer and graeme and kailana and anyone here at blo has a right to post their thoughts up here!

i have heard that nick has been banned here
and i am here to set that story right!

its obvious that childs play is at work here
and its usually those that call others "immature" or "threatening" that the name callers are the ones that are having issues themselves personally with being the immature ones!

i call on a debate between duckslammer and myself
i also ask you graeme about why would you want to disrupt such a great site such as blo.......its not that i see you disrupting anything in this link but you are certainly siding with duckslammer on this one and thats just adding fuel to the fire!
i call on a debate about nick,with nick present!
i know that nicks views are as extreme as mine but in a different way
i know that nick knows what i think of his views
we both talk together sometimes

its a disgrace that someone like duckslammer would open up this thread
with"i am so all high and mighty because i have been on xxy forum groups the last 10 years-----i know all there needs to know"
and then proceed to state to the world that he believes that nicks posts and account should be deleted!

thats some cheek
and its the people in supposed power that need to be told to calm their holy self down sometimes

graeme do us all a favour
and be the guy that i think you are when you first joined youtube!
duckslammer realise that you are as important as nick is important

and both of you re-read what kailana wrote!

[roguekiwixxy]

ok ......i heard about this through the grapevine! now i read that its you duckslammer who likes to slam doors shut in peoples faces!



Ohhhh you're brave, attacking duckslammer is not a wise idea, and even when you don't know anything, starting a falme war is not a good way to begin Gavan.


nick and duckslammer and graeme and kailana and anyone here at blo has a right to post their thoughts up here!



All Nicky ever does is flame people, unless you have some new information that you can prove Gavan?


i have heard that nick has been banned here
and i am here to set that story right!


I think the thread "The Nonsense of Nicky" is still here, have you read it? Possibly that might be a really good idea befoe you go jumping to conclusions?


its obvious that childs play is at work here
and its usually those that call others "immature" or "threatening" that the name callers are the ones that are having issues themselves personally with being the immature ones!



Oh so you do have knoweledge of what Nicky says and why he says such silly things!


i call on a debate between duckslammer and myself



Duckslammer will eat you for breakfast, you have no idea what you're doing, he is a formidable opponent, and you do not have the stamina.


i also ask you graeme about why would you want to disrupt such a great site such as blo.......



Yes I can tell, you really want to get things right before you speak, that's why you cnotacted me via You Tube and let your concers be known ...... oh sorry, you didn't did you, you didn't check anything out, not a thing, oh well, don't start a fight with duckslammer, you don't know what you're doing, just admit you've been duped and let things settle down.


its not that i see you disrupting anything in this link but you are certainly siding with duckslammer on this one and thats just adding fuel to the fire!
i call on a debate about nick,with nick present!



Of course I side with ducslammer, he's my mate, been so for more than 10 years....waddya expect?


i know that nicks views are as extreme as mine but in a different way
i know that nick knows what i think of his views
we both talk together sometimes



I wonder if Nicky is even a human being, he doesn't argue he has no views, he has no logic, no character, no reason, no thought, he's simply offensive, constantly.


its a disgrace that someone like duckslammer would open up this thread
with"i am so all high and mighty because i have been on xxy forum groups the last 10 years-----i know all there needs to know"



Man you are just asking for trouble, you need to give people you don't know much more respect.



Nonsense deleted


graeme do us all a favour
and be the guy that i think you are when you first joined youtube!
duckslammer realise that you are as important as nick is important



Nicky is gthe biggest idiot that ever walked the face ogf the earth, if he even exists, and I have my doubts. Like he's just a cheap trick by a psychyology class trying to see how many peole they can sucker into believing Nicky actually exists!


and both of you re-read what kailana wrote!

I have that person safely tucked away.

[OkieDokie]

ok ......

i heard about this through the grapevine!

now i read that its you duckslammer who likes to slam doors shut in peoples faces!

It's like this, Gavan. These online forums are here to serve a whole community, not just one person. A community is made up of various individuals each with their own needs. Inevitably conflicts will arise, and everyone has to be willing to work it out. When there is one person who only considers his own needs, his own wants, who does things that screw it up for everybody else, well then, action has to be taken. That is why online forums are not a democracy and they do practice censorship.

Nicky can't see past the end of his nose. He is hateful towards trans people. That's what sunk him, nothing else. It is not allowed to spew hate at the community one is a part of, simply not tolerated. These communities were formed in part because we were disrespected and dismissed by "normal" society, we don't have to put up with it from one of our own members.

Nicky's hatefulness towards trans is what prompted me to engage him here, and on xxytalk. I don't tolerate prejudice, especially towards XXY, intersex and trans. The flamewars were just a byproduct of all that. The prejudiced person is gone, no need for any more flamage.

You don't need a grapevine to tell you what I said, my messages are public, read them for yourself.

[Peter]

ok ......

i heard about this through the grapevine!........

i have heard that nick has been banned here
and i am here to set that story right!......

its obvious that childs play is at work here


Hi Gavan,

I couple of people have contacted me to express their concerns about the banning of Nick. I would like to provide additional information about why I banned Nick. I did not ban Nick because of the flames on this site. I had given a warning to all involved that the flames should stop, or I would consider banning people. Many people who come here have issues. I hope that people with issues can work through their issues. There are issues between transsexual people and intersex people. I was hoping that Nick would meet other intersex people here and work through his past anger towards transsexual people. However, I believe that there is a big difference between people who have issues, and people who are haters. Nick is a hater. Haters see other people as sub-human. In reading Canice's post about a recent legal decision and Nick's response to it, it became clear that Nick did not support the right of a transsexual person to hold a job for which they were qualified, and which they had been offered the position, until they revealed their desires to transition to their new employer. A judge held that it was sex discrimination. I am not a lawyer, and do not know the fine points of the case, but I image that the judge recognized that when a person was offered a job as a man, and subsequently denied it as a woman that it would be assumed to be sex discrimination on the basis of limiting job opportunities on the basis of sex. The judge seems to have recognized that you cannot take away the jobs of transsexuals solely on the basis of their being transsexual. In disagreeing with this, Nick reveals himself as a hater who believes that it is acceptable to deny job opportunites to transsexuals. I banned Nick because he is a hater, and not because of the flames on this board. I still may ban people for flaming, but I hope that things settle down around here.

Peter

[peaceandparty]

hi peter and duckslammer and graeme!

nick,as much as his hatred for trans people gets the better of him,is a good person!

definetely he has warped ways of dealing with people sometimes
but nick is also a very pleasant person
its just that these issues of identity and where we ,as intersexed, fit in into societies rigid categorisation boxes are extremely frustrating and hard to explain and highly emotional...

i think that flaming / ranting is and can be acceptable to a point
we need a good community online here
and BLO has certainly got a great reputation for allowing all sorts of carry on!

we need more carers!
i know its a hard thing to deal with when you have someone hating more and more
but i must speak out for nick!
he is not a hater but rather he is hating and also being hated by many .
his views are as extreme as graemes or mine or most xxys in general

i think that people that come to BLO are very sensitive creatures
and i thi nk we shouldnt forget that!

i am happy that BLO strives for excellence
i just think nick should be given another chance before he becomes a hating liar and sets upa pseudo name!

helping people with their anger/hate without being haters ourselves in the process is the soundest way!

[miriam]

c'mon Gavan, you really have no idea what's going on here. Stop writing and take a couple of days to read everything.


Nick is full of hate against transsexual people and even-though I disagree with the ideas of A to Z I think it is unacceptable someone like Nick is addressing her with 'he' and 'his'. The fact that Nick refused to apologize for being rude is more than enough reason to kick Nick

Groeten, Miriam

[fraulein_Maria]

[QUOTE=peaceandparty;17930]
i just think nick should be given another chance before he becomes a hating liar and sets upa pseudo name!


>>> wayyyyyy too late for that i fear.... but it was wayyyy too late before he ever came here. <<<

[peaceandparty]

ok....if nick is truly gone...lets at least discuss the reasons why people come to such hatred!

its obvious that the trans movement has made it much more difficult for intersexed people to be taken seriously

and the term DSD
is a most dis satisfactory abbreviation and meaning!

and the xxy movie portraying a hermaphrodite has upset many people who term themselves klinefelters!

i think the bigger picture is(and here is where all of you can go wild in disagreeing but in a respectful manner----we all have our own opinions)
that there is not a lot of 100%males and 100%females out there
even though the medical community will insist that there are only two sexes in the world
i think human nature is evolving and without being properly dealt with
if there was a true acceptance that its not just stereotypical males and stereotypical females in the world,then ultimately all sorts of issues would arise
what do we call an "it"...because "he" and "she" cant be used
sex in languages in grammar especially would be affected!

but i think many trans people are transitioning from what they would call male to female or female to male
what if people were just seen as people
as individuals
what if we didnt need to categorise ....what if....what if....
yeah!well!
:)

just because people are in the same groups...doesnt mean we are absolutely the same people in evry aspect of our minds!

i think nicks hatred is not worse than graeme or miriams hatred
its just different hate!

i think we need to accept diversity and difference
truly accept
not reject!

[peaceandparty]

c'mon Gavan, you really have no idea what's going on here. Stop writing and take a couple of days to read everything.


Nick is full of hate against transsexual people and even-though I disagree with the ideas of A to Z I think it is unacceptable someone like Nick is addressing her with 'he' and 'his'. The fact that Nick refused to apologize for being rude is more than enough reason to kick Nick

Groeten, Miriam

i would suggest to anyone completely new to this thread and its people to read through a lot before getting involved
but seeing as i know nick and graeme and many others here including prince..ess---well i am well able as a diplomat to come in here and stand my ground and also stand up for the rights of others too

we are all one but we are not the same!

i am not against you miriam....just would like to see more friendliness and a lack of presumptions of others!

:)

[fraulein_Maria]

[QUOTE=peaceandparty;17948]

i am not against you miriam....just would like to see more friendliness and a lack of presumptions of others!


>>> gavin, as someone who has respectfully crossed swords with miriam (and she with me) i can safely say that HATE is not a word that i would charge her with. As for presumption...

if you had actually READ the threads you would see that she contributed NOTHING to the flame war initiated BY NICKY...

so i believe the coal colored cooking impliment, is calling the creosote encrusted caldrun, a negro. <<<

[peaceandparty]

i ACTUALLY have read most if not all the threads regarding the crap that has been talked about recently

i know that miriam didnt start any flames nor did miriam add to the flames
but miriam didnt exactly welcome me or anyone else to even try to get their feet wet on this issue
miriam insinuated that its a fire nearly gone out and that i should not come in on somethin g that i am not familiar with

the thing i am familiar with is the majority of people involved in this now scandal

and i am also familiar with the misunderstandings that happen on written blogs
so i am going to do a video for all of you
as short as ican make it
i hope you will watch it!

gavAn......hahahaha
smile and the whole world smiles with you