hi im new..

[beecee]

im fairly new, this is a great website but I dont really know how it works!

[beecee]

Well, I dont know how long this takes for a respond im wayy too used to the instant gratification of messengers haha but i'll get myself started. I never felt right and have been battling social stigmas my entire life without a soul knowing now that im so institutionalized I dont know how to act the way I am anymore I just came out (even though i dont think thats an appropriate expression) to my mom and best friend this week actually. I hope to post my journey on this thing seeing that so many people are active on it, i would love to hear more about this!

[beecee]

damnit! wrong message board! i think intersex people are wonderful gifts! unless the dictionary has the wrong definition between sex and gender i may be on the wrong board someone inform me?

[notodd]

Hi, I'm new too.

[Peggy]

Hi Beecee,

If you want a response, how about telling a little about yourself, your personal situation, the issues you are concerned about, etc? The guidelines for this forum actually discourage content-free one-liners.

Please note that this is a discussion board for intersex persons and issues affecting intersex persons. So far, you have not said a word about that.

Peggy

[eli]

I'm 52 y.o. and found out that i am CAH about 4 months ago. I want to pursue ftm transition (at least top surgery) but cant for alot of reasons. I have a 12 y.o. daughter who and is going through her own development and would not understand, does not need the teasing in school. I am gay and the CAH stuff led to my divorce 4 yrs ago (when my daughter was 8); I have lots of health stuff (transplants, osteoporosis, anemia, low blood pressure) and I'm 52 y.o.! It's overwhelming. I'm in counseling now for depression. Never needed that before. I want to run away or something. I can't believe I didn't catch on earlier in my life. But, now so much else makes sense. I like the validation. I don't like the loss of my past, the stigma and the inability to be who i am without being ostrasized or thought of as a freak. As i read about others' experiences and issues here, this forum and web site have already been helpful. I think i need to connect somewhere so i guess i'm trying to do that here.

[eli]

I'm 52 y.o. and found out that i am CAH about 4 months ago. I want to pursue ftm transition (at least top surgery) but cant for alot of reasons. I have a 12 y.o. daughter who and is going through her own development and would not understand, does not need the teasing in school. I am gay and the CAH stuff led to my divorce 4 yrs ago; I have lots of health stuff (transplants, osteoporosis, anemia, low blood pressure) and I'm 52 y.o.! It's overwhelming. I'm in counseling now for depression. Never needed that before. I want to run away or something. I can't believe I didn't catch on earlier in my life. But, now so much else makes sense. I like the validation. I don't like the loss of my past, the stigma and the inability to be who i am without being ostrasized or thought of as a freak. As i read about others' experiences and issues here, this forum and web site have already been helpful. I think i need to connect somewhere so i guess i'm trying to do that here.

[spacegirl]

Hi Eli. It's possible you didn't catch on earlier in life because it wasn't there as much back then. A lot of the people they call late onset, it can kind of creep up on them. Health problems can bring down most people's mood a lot easier than they think. But now that you know, cah can be managed.

[eli]

Hi Spacegirl. Thank you for responding to my post. My parents and my doctor knew I was CAH but they decided to keep it a secret from me. They did the surgery they thought they should do, but they chose wrong. I don't blame them. That's what was done back then. Now I understand what all the shots were for and why I looked different to kids until I had additional surgery at age 7 or 8. But, now I guess I am not gay, but a straight transgender male who grew up as a female with issues. I haven't had the srs surgery yet though and probably won't because I don't want to risk confusing or otherwise having an adverse emotional effect on my daughter. I am also interested in finding intersex parents who have children who are not intersex. Thanks for any help you can give me with this or any of the other many aspects of being intersex.

[spacegirl]

Now I'm confused

[JOS]

Welcome to BLO

it does sound like you've been through a lot.

I can understand that you don't want to upset your daughter but have you ever talked to her about any of this? (on a level she's ready for)

... it's only that kids are pretty sensitive and she's probably already picked up on your upset but might think she's somehow to blame.
true you wouldn't want to worry her but maybe if you don't help her to understand where your head is at it could be bad in a different way?

I'm not a parent though so.....

I hope you find the conversations here helpful :beer:

[spacegirl]

Just curious Eli, why is it better to sacrifice apparently healthy breasts and maybe be thought a man than to be a lesbian? Any moments of pleasure you might get from them will be gone, maybe to be replaced with lasting pain sensations.

Depression can make people think strange things. It seems lke the choice you're making ought to be made when you're on top of the world and having good days.

Immitating Clarence the guardian angel wasn't part of my bucket list, but I suppose I can try.

If the doctors you say chose wrong had made the "right" decision, your daughter (who you appear to care about) would never have existed. But the desire for a child (or your biological clock) would still be inside you ticking away, only unanswerable.

I'll thnk of more later, if this wasn't upsetting.

[eli]

Your last post was not upsetting at all. They are good questions and I have thought about some of those things myself. My situation is very confusing and seems rather weird to me, but I hope I'm not totally unique. I hope someone else can relate somewhat. And, I do appreciate your efforts to understand and be supportive. Yes, having my daughter would not have happened if I had lived a different life and she is worth everything to me. She is not my biological daughter though. I thought I was a lesbian and my partner of 12 years had her. We raised her together until the divorce. I adopted her so she is both legally and emotionally mine. I have a good relationship with my ex, her new partner, their baby son and my daughter. As far as not having breasts, that would be wonderful to me. I have never wanted them and went through my life trying to hide them. I was actually quite surprised to learn that women actually like having breasts! I thought that they just had to tolerate them. I just don't like having a woman's body. A mistake was made after I was born, but, like you said, I do have my daughter and that's alot. I actually have alot going for me that I have to remember. Thanks.

[fraulein_Maria]

[QUOTE=eli;21427] A mistake was made after I was born,

>>> alot of us are trying to put a stop to cosmetic infant surgery. a praeder 4-5 should be given the choice to be raised male if they wish.

those of us 1-2 should not be forced to have our clits chopped off. Where do we live? afghanistan? africa?I really wish i still had it as it was.

praeder 3 is a grey area... a common UG sinus DOES need fixing.... But it can be fixed without excizing tissue.

[eli]

Thank you for responding. I don't know much about my CAH condition yet. I'm still learning. Where can I find out more about praeder 1-5?

[spacegirl]

Hi Eli,

You know, if they had gone the other way and pronounced you "male" at birth, right now the world's opinion isn't that females with cah (even lesbians) are really straight men. It's that males who are xx with cah are "really" women (lesbians if they thought they were straight) Unfortunately, that opinion is being used in a growing number of states which are legally defining people by their chromosomes. They have to have some definition of "male" and "female' in order to ban gay marriages and oppress the gay community.

Right now, depending on where you lived, you could be having your manly social identity being ripped out from underneath you by an oppressive local government.

[The Female Eunuch]

Spacegirl wrote: Right now, depending on where you lived, you could be having your manly social identity being ripped out from underneath you by an oppressive local government.

I used to know a woman who was a victim of that same thinking right back in the 1960s. She was a teenager in Queensland, Australia, raised as female, and when doctors discovered she had PAIS they insisted her gender be changed to male to match her XY chromosomes. She commented to me that it was remarkable she hadn't been killed by the huge doses of testosterone they gave her in an attempt to masculinise her.

When she told me about this, I assumed this was the sort of thing that happened in the bad old days - that it was only because chromosomes had only just been discovered then and people hadn't had much time to learn about the shortcomings of chromosome testing.

cheers,
Caroline

[fraulein_Maria]

[QUOTE=eli;21444]Thank you for responding. I don't know much about my CAH condition yet. I'm still learning. Where can I find out more about praeder 1-5

>>> as much as i despise them,

www.CARESfoundation.org

really does have the best medical literature on the subject. Just don't try to get any emotional support from them.... that's only for "the parents" who are obviously suffering more than you *voice dripping with sarcasm*

[spacegirl]

Cares seemed nice enough to me, maybe they just reserve their kindness for those who didn't fail their cah screening?

[fraulein_Maria]

[QUOTE=spacegirl;21486]Cares seemed nice enough to me, maybe they just reserve their kindness for those who didn't fail their cah screening?

>>> and what makes you think i did?

they hate my guts (and the guts of every CAH) who objects to being mutilated.

try it some time. just for kicks. go to one of the CARES sponsored forums. Object to the practice of cosmetic infant surgery. You will find yourself on there $hit list really fast.

Kelly Leight called me up and SCREAMED in my ear loud enough for my deaf landlady to hear on the other side of the house... she asked me if i wanted to call the cops...

what she screamed was that she would sue me for libel if i didn't shut up.

i haven't shut up, and i got nothing more than a threatening letter from her after that.

she can't do anything to me, because i haven't lied.

I suppose you think i failed because i have no beard.

I'm native american, my brother's don't have beards.

But i was born a praeder 2 and had a surgical "reduction".

Apparently, i passed someone's test for CAH back then.

You are right to be skeptical though. Not everyone who claims to have CAH actually has it.

Some XY trans people claim to have it (concurrently with other IS conditions) to justify there existence

Some XX lesbians claim to have it to justify there orientation

I could give a rats ass about either.

I wanted to find out in my early 20's why i... an other-wise healthy even athletic woman was passing out from "dehydration".
Why other's complained of a stench... no matter how often (or how recently) i showered.
Why did all my team-mates think i was shooting "T" like they were?
Why did shots in the ass of cortisol NOT send me into a manic episode?

My parents (a demonically abusive pair) insisted the only problem was in my head... and did there best to convince me and the rest of the world of this falsehood... to cover there own sins.

I reached out to CARES.... and was told rather nastily "no beard = not CAH". Not once, but several times over the years.

Amazing how there lay volunteers can Dx anyone over the phone in less then 10 seconds by asking that one Q.

So

I highly recommend there website. Its medical information is first rate.

But there policy leaves much to be desired.

How very different they would be.... If like AIS-USA.....

It was run by the patients... Not the parents.

You don't see ANYTHING wrong with this picture?

We are the only adult group that is run that way.....

:pat: i forgot! support groups for the mentally ill are run by the parents!

I'm not, thank you. Real support will happen when its JUST US and the doctors who research and treat us.

I don't need to be with a group of people who desparately want to justify the harm they've done there daughters.... and will THREATEN ANYONE who suggests they have.

DES moms, in comparison, usually have great sorrow over what they did to there kids, and usually do not live in the land of denial.

[Kailana]

I would add that GendersinX is another good support forum run by patients and they do have a fair number of posters though sometimes the forums on their are a little slow.

oh and I second Maria's opinion of CARES though see another side she seldom states lol. The over abundant usage of 21HSD to explain what CAH can do to a person. sorry but there are many other variations of CAH and they are seldom if ever mentioned.

Fraulein_Maria is our 3B, spacegirl 11B, and me im just a general confusion of no answers to validate what variation of CAH i actually have due to know first hand medical experiences though 2nd hand and 3rd hand would likely fit 17B best. I happen to stil be fightig for that 1st hand unquestionable DX to figure out what form of CAH is present because unlike many women, I had the great missfortune of being dxd with adrenal genital Syndrome with no explanation about what variation of CAH is actually affecting me.

oh and Fraulein_maria I so hope that comment of there are xy trans who say they are CAH with other conditions present is not a slam against me. Not that I have heard of any falling out between us but seriously your comment appears vaguely directed to me as I think I am the only one who has ever stated that they have 2 conditions both dx'd and I am unaware of anyone ever coming to BLO stating the same who is also reassiging.

:thinking2 oh wait forgot i dont think

[eli]

Thank you both for the web sites and warnings. I'll check them out. I likely will not meet their def of CAH (no beard), but hopefully I'll learn something. Thanks.