View Full Version : The state of our world---totally off topic
This is not a Bodies message. It is a message from a very sad human being who needs to get something off her chest.
I am so sad this evening; tears are streaming down my face.
How is it that our country has come to the point of being the agressor? How is it that a president who wasn't even elected by the majority of Americans can get away with invading a country that can't in their wildest dreams harm us?
So many innocent, young people will die in this unjust war--sons, daughters, fathers, mothers, sisters, brothers, partners, husbands, wives. Cousins, uncles, aunts...thousands will likely die in this misguided attempt at world domination.
It is unjust for us to be there to revenge the failure of our non-elected moron's father. Our economy is in the toilet, yet we are spending billions to fight a ghost. What happened to the search for Osama? It's wag the dog time.
Our non-elected leaders have oil on the brain and yet they say our national security is at risk. Please, Bush and playmates, spare me from your lies; they are too transparent for my intellect.
There was a great article in one of the Atlanta weeklies published today at http://atlanta.creativeloafing.com/cover.html Read it, and you will see some of the lies our appointed leadership has put forth. Most of our media has been in-step with our appointed govt because they don't want to threaten their "embedded" place on the front line. Trust me here...we are not reading and hearing the truth about Saddam. I speak from first-hand knowledge and I know that the media that tells the truth now will lose their coverage privilages. You can't make money if you're not there showing God, Glory, and Ammo. Don't count on seeing our dead loved ones on live TV. It won't happen; the media and the miliary is so deep in bed that the truth will evade us. Maybe when the innocent 18 and 19 year olds who got sent there come home in body bags the "play nice" attitude of the american media will change. I hope they are designing the war memorial now because it will be needed soon; I hope they include the innocent. It's money, and the sons and daughters of those leading to war are not included.
The USA has recently been buying oil from Saddam. We put the man in power. Heck, we put Osama in power, and look what our pragmatism got us there.
Our gay and lesbian service members are still forced to remain in the closet. Frankly, if I was in the military, I would be putting "queer" on everything I owned to avoid killing innocent human beings under pressure. America is not a nation built upon kill or be killed. It is a nation built upon peace and non-aggression.
Who has threatened to use weapons of mass-destruction here? We have! We have a big ol' bomb---the biggest non-nuclear bomb known is owned by the US and they couldn't wait to show it off so they sent press releases and video. Our appointed leadership has threatened nuclear war to erase the failures of their daddy.
Nuclear war? Get ready to kiss your ass goodbye if that happens. All the duct tape and plastic in the world won't save us if Georgie has a vision that our nuclar power will save the world. We are no longer the center of our universe and it is time that we admit that failure of our appointed leadership to recognize that.
Our civil rights have gone away with the wind. Do a search on the patriot act. Check out the media that isn't tied to big business. The truth is out there, but you may have to dig for it.
Merely posting this may lead to the John Ashcroft's minions showing up at my door. It's come to that and it is sad. I feel so strongly and so sad that I'm willing to deal with it.
I can't speak for what the feeling is in Peoria, but working in NYC a couple of days a week, I can share the fears and outrage I am seeing there. Tonight entering the Lincoln Tunnel, there wasn't a police officer in sight! I am grateful upon exiting the tunnel each time I leave it. People are scared, and they are reacting.
They are leaving the cities. Tonight, I was shocked at how much traffic there was exiting the city when I left. It definitely wasn't a normal Tuesday night commute. The CIA has said that terrorist attacks on our soil are almost certain if we carry-out this unjust invasion. Why must more innocent people die to line the pockets of our apponted leadership? Why am I under threat because I am in a building two days a week that has specific threats made against it? It's nonsensical!
Many of my co-workers who know I live far away from the city approached me this evening asking if the can come and camp in my meadow. These are journalists! It was bizarre. People are scared. They are scared of the lone martyrs that will blow themselves up in the subway and drop bombs in trash cans because of the actions of our appointed leadership. I almost expect that when I get back from our upcoming road show there will be an encampment in said meadow. I can't say no because I am a human being who respects our right to live free of unjust leadership.
The theme I am hearing here is that Bush has to go; I agree.
He needs to be impeached for his illegal actions threatening the residents of this country and the horrors that will be brought upon the innocent residents of the middle east, here, and our interests abroad. Congressional approval is necessary for the declaration of war, yet the appointed idiot hasn't botherered with such annoyances while he gets out his lasso.
Get involved with your local peace movement if you can. If you can't protest in person, make your voice heard at http://www.votetoimpeach.org/
These people are dangerous, and they are dangerous to us. They are the ones who will cause us grief and heartache. It's time folks, to make a stand and get rid of the idiots.
Thanks for listening.
The poem below was written by a 12 year old I know. I think it gives wonderful insight into what Bush's follies of how his actions are affecting our world:
I Hope There’s A World
By Kristine
February 27, 2003
12:01am
I hope there’s a world left to live in
when I grow up
I hope there’s a place to be
when I am grown
I pray we do not destroy each other
with hate
I wish we wouldn’t kill each other
with wars
I hope there’s a world left to live in
when I grow up
People torture
hate
oppress
kill
for power?
for religion?
for respect?
I hope there’s a world left to live in
when I grow up
Too many people
who are too strong
to have mercy
too stubborn
to admit fault
too proud
to admit defeat
I hope there’s a world left to live in
when I grow up
I wish I could show people how to see
past hate
farther than wars reach
I wish I could show how much pain
hate brings
but those who need to see it the most
can’t
I hope there’s a world left to live in
when I grow up
So I wonder
how many tears must be cried
or do they have to create a river
how many people have to die
or do we all
before they realize
it’s all for nothing
I hope there’s a world left to live in
when I grow up
But if the world stays the same
when I grow up
there’s no chance we’ll ever change
the hate
the wars
the oppression
will not die with our elders
but will be taught to us
and it is these lessons we must ignore
I hope there’s a world left to live in
when I grow up
And I hope that it has changed
--Kristine
May be peace with us.
Betsy
I recall as a child wondering what it was like to live during the parts of history you read about in history books.
I don't like it at all.
I don't know how to tell my 17-year-old stepson whether the draft will be reinstated, because I just don't know.
We just bought a bunch of Japanese Maple saplings at the Philly flower show, and I wonder if we'll see them grow up.
I try to reassure my stepkids that, even in the worst circumstances, most people survive. Poland lost a third of its population in WWII - but that means two thirds still made it. It doesn't feel very consoling, though.
I try to reassure my family that Philadelphia is pretty low on most lists of military or symbolic targets. Doesn't help much, especially since we're downwind from most of the country.
Glenn, looking for a big rock to hide under
Natasha (again)
09-13-03, 04:31 AM
I view with great alarm what our government is doing in the Persian Gulf. I too am very saddened. Yet I am anything but surprised. I have been warning people that this was going to happen, ever since Ronald Wilson Reagan became President in 1980. I know for a fact that I am on their little list.
I am saddened that so many people think that The New World Order is somehow Christian, or has anything to do with real Christianity. Far from it, in fact the reverse is true.
Yes, the New World Order as George Bush Sr. termed it, is beginning to gain control of the world economy. They are right on schedule, exactly as predicted. I have been passing on the message about that for years. Just enter natasha_thompson into the Google search engine. Do a search in Google Groups and the web, and sort by date. Lots of other whacky stuff as well, but I continue to be a work in progress.
It has now become obvious that the Iraq 'wars' were not about weapons of mass destruction. As many of us knew all along. It was about OIL. And so will further military action in the Persian Gulf be, as they continue their conquest of the entire Persian Gulf.
Saudi Arabia is now being painted as an enemy which backed 911. Iran has long been on their list. Syria is also being cast in a different light than in times past, as something sinister. Soon big oil government will attack both nations, and thereby gain control of their oil. Of course this will involve Iran and Turkey, and more also.
Whoever controls the world economy, will of course have unlimited political power. In controlling Oil completely, as they will eventually. They will control the entire world, and so everyone who lives in it.
Because OIL is the foundation of the world economy,
and BIG OIL is our government. We live in interesting
times.
What does any of this have to do with Christianity
really? Only this.
The book of Revelation chapter 13 tells of the Antichrist, and the Second Beast who comes 'immediately' after him. Two men who spearhead and lead a world government. Which will have control of all buying and selling world wide. The book of Daniel in the old testament explains. That they will gain control of the world economy. By attacking and defeating the oil rich nations of the Persian Gulf, beginning with Iraq.
Revelation chapter 13 identifies these two men, whom it refers to as the Two Beasts. The Antichrist and the Second Beast.
Revelation states the Antichrist is a human man, with a great speaking ability. Who is such a persuasive orator you could call him the Great Communicator. It says also that the Antichrist is wounded mortally while in the world spotlight, and the world is astonished that he survives.
Revelation then says that he would be followed immediately by the Second Beast. The next guy in office who has the same power and authority he had. Who has a kind and gentle image like a lamb, who talks like a dragon.
This Second Beast would make the world worship 'the image' of the Antichrist (beast) who precedes him, and cause all who live on earth, to receive the number of that man's name. All must have it, to buy or sell. It says you just count the number of the first beast's name, and it sums out as 6 6 6. No numerology required.
There is only one significantly powerful man in all of history whose name, sums out as 6 6 6 just by counting it.
Now please count the number of letters in this former US President's name. There are six letters in RONALD, in WILSON and also in REAGAN.
He is the only world leader in all of history, to have a birth name like that. Ronald Wilson Reagan absolutely was an 'image President'. The most popular in US history, he was and still is virtually worshiped by his many followers.
He is also referred to by many, as the Great Communicator for his notable eloquence.
He was mortally wounded while in office, and he astonished the world when he shrugged it off.
He was also succeeded immediately by a tough talking man, with a kind and gentle "lamby" image. George H. W. Bush ran on the platform of "a kinder gentler America". Yet he talked tough of war, and then invaded Iraq. His son carries on the agenda.
Revelation states that the second beast would have the power to call down fire from heaven. Bush and his son, have been raining fire down all over the world. Their catch phrase should be, Bombs R Us.
After immediately establishing diplomatic relations with The
Vatican, in stark defiance of the Constitution. The Reagan
administration next expanded our Social Security number from
9 to 18 digits. If you don't believe me look at any post Reagan
era Social Security card. There are the usual 9 digits on the
front, and an addition 9 digits on the back printed in red. You
cannot legally have a job, or a bank account without it.
The US Federal government has long said eventually we will have to go cashless, and all transactions will be by debit card. This to counteract counterfeiting and terrorism. By Federal law (Reagan did this too), all Electronic Funds Transfer accounts, debit cards etc., must use your Social Security number as your account number. The digits are scrambled to protect your identity, but it is your SS number.
Surely in response to terrorism, this plan shall move forth quickly.
There will be additional convenient acts of terrorism
(reminiscent of the Reichstag fire IMO) to further
justify our "trading some of our freedoms for safety",
as Bush Jr. once said.
That right there is high treason IMO. Freedom is what America
is all about, or at least it was.
Natasha
Last night my wife and I watched The Pianist; about a world-class pianist in Warsaw who survived the Ghetto and WWII.
As I watched the events unfold, all I could think was how well we have learned from the Nazis. If you just take away freedoms a little bit at a time, no one complains too loudly. The cumulative effect can still be devastating.
Natasha (again)
09-13-03, 06:54 PM
Isn't it amazing how well the fascist formula
works?
Even though the entire world observed what
happened in Germany just a relatively short
time ago, it is happening here and now.
It seems that Toynbee was right.
The only thing we have learned
from history, is that we fail to
learn from history.
I believe the MARKET crash and the seeming
resulting economic depression were purposely
engineered. As a strategy to get everyones
mind occupied with survival, rather than upon
what is going on around them.
Hard times rearrange peoples priorities. So
whatever abuses they do manage to
notice, as long as it doesn't affect them
directly are less important compared to their
own survival.
If you want to boil a frog in a
pot without a lid. Put it in cold
water, and turn on the heat.
Then let it come to boil slowly.
This way the poor creature has
no idea what is happening, until
it is too late.
You are right Glenn. That is exactly what they are doing
to us right now.
Further, there is real evidence that the same
people who are behind the New World Order,
were also behind the Third Reich. Follow the
money to the same doorsteps.
Natasha (again)
09-14-03, 10:35 AM
Some people say that Nero was the Antichrist.
All you have to do to settle that, is consider this.
In Nero's time the known world was far smaller than it is
today. It was not even possible for Nero to either know,
or to be known of, "all who dwell upon the earth".
Neither was it possible for his immediate successor to
cause "all who live upon the earth", to receive his name,
his mark (old word for signature), or the number of his
name to be allowed to buy or sell.
This is so for the following reasons.
1. What that false doctrine makes 666 of is Nero's title,
not his name as Revelation specifies.
2. This is accomplished using numerology. Which is so
arbitrary it can be used to make 666 out of any word,
because there are thousands of numerological
formulas. Revelation instructs us to 'count' the number
of his 'name'.
3. Nero was not "immediately succeeded" by 'anyone'
"having the same power and authority", as Revelation
states the AC would be.
4. Nero was not mortally wounded and survived it to
"astonish the entire world". Neither at any time did
"all who dwell upon the earth" worship his image,
wonder after him, say who is like unto the beast who
is able to make war against him?, etc., etc..
5. Neither did his immediate successor "having the same
power and authority", call fire down from heaven.
6. Neither was it technologically or logistically possible in
those days. For Nero's immediate successor "having the
same power and authority", IF HE HAD ONE. To "cause
all who dwell upon the earth to receive the mark, the
name, or the number of the name", etc.. Let alone forbid
all buying and selling without it, ....... because,
Rome as large an empire as it was. Was unaware of most
of the world's people, or even the geographical areas they
dwelt upon. They thought the world was flat. They had no
idea the western hemisphere even existed. Much of the
world in fact, at that time relied on the barter system, and
had never seen a Roman coin.
None of this happened because,
a. There was no mass media reaching "all who dwell upon
the face of the earth".
b. Rome did not have an Air Force with bombers.
c. The technological ability to control all buying and selling
GLOBALLY at that, DID NOT EXIST AT THAT TIME.
There is some connection to Rome involved in all of this
however. The first thing Reagan did upon assuming
office. Was to establish diplomatic relations with the
Vatican. Prior to Reagan, this had never been done.
The Archdiocese of Chicago is the only archdiocese in the world that is incorporated. That's why Cardinal Francis George can sell the archdiocesal mansion and take the proceeds for himself. This situation is not very pleasing to the Vatican. It is also the largest archdiocese in the world (I'm pretty sure that is what I heard.).
To stay on good terms with the Vatican Cardinal George makes numerous trips there. They try to send Frank incensed. He's more pleasant that way.
Other trivia:
The Vatican opposed the US invasion of Iraq.
The president should not have graduated high school but he graduated from Yale, even though his main scholastic achievement was partying hearty.
The media claims his approval rating is 55 per cent. I wonder who they polled.
Congress almost unanimously passed the infamous Patriot Act in reaction to the fall of the Twin Towers. Did they lose their minds too?
Natasha (again)
09-14-03, 05:09 PM
Very interesting.
I am not a big fan of the Vatican, but I am not anti
Catholic. For one thing the Vatican has always
been very anti-Semitic. I am not sure which killed
more Jews, the Inquisition or the Holocaust. Of
course millions upon millions were murdered.
Some of my relatives among them.
Bush Jr., well he's obviously a scion, and a puppet
of his father. His IQ, is average at best.
From YALE to the Presidency, it is obvious that Jr.,
is benefiting from his connection to his "dad". It
didn't hurt to have his brother as Governor of
Florida during the "election" either.
Just thinking about it, gives me butterflies.
Natasha
It gives me butterflies too. Thinking about us becoming a nuclear nation again is horrifying. It seems only wishes that we would stop meddling in other nations' affairs and pay more attention to our own. We have become the worst example in the way our nation has behaved. The expenses are horrendous. I don't like becoming the Ugly American all over again. I don't like our neglect of the poor for the benefit of those who do not need it. I don't like anyone who destroys our own country just because they hate someone else. That itself seems like a coverup for a job badly done. I wish the whole lot of our so-called leaders would just go into exile since they can't seem to get any sense. But without a government we would just be like Afghanistan and Iraq, who don't have any since we did away with theirs.
It seems like only yesterday that we finished paying for World War II. And now we are at creating new holocausts for power and oil, which will be exhausted in a few decades. Why couldn't Jr. have been satisfied with an Esso station? Being an oil tycoon was beyond his ability. Too bad it is not his daddy's money bailing us out of this one. His credit may be good, but not that good.
Shalom! Pax! Hoa binh! Ruhe!
Dawn
Natasha (again)
09-15-03, 04:23 PM
Shalom aleichem.
Yes it is all very frightening, but it is a signal that
the age of darkness we have all long been within,
is coming to an end.
In other words. After things come to their worst
here soon. It can only get better.
True we are heading for the bottom, the very
worst of all times. Yet such darkest of hours,
only heralds the brightest dawn.
It is great to meet you Uriela.
Natasha
The media claims his approval rating is 55 per cent. I wonder who they polled.
I'm constantly wondering that too. Maybe it is my social circle, but I haven't talked to anyone in ages that thinks he is worthy of that office.
The NYTimes had a great article over the weekend about how the budget surplus has gone away under Bush. You need to register to read the article but it is free (and they don't spam): http://www.nytimes.com/2003/09/14/politics/14DEFI.html
Pay particular attention to the graphics which show exactly how he has raped this nation.
They went into Iraq in an unjust confrontation, and almost every day someone is getting that dreaded knock at the door. The BBC had an article some months back stating how Bush saw the 9/11 attacks as a calling from God to him directly. Muslims in this nation disappear without a trace, thrown into the dungeons that Ashcroft calls the Patriot Act. Was it pure coincidence that the pope and Bush spoke out against gay marriage within hours of eachother earlier this summer? Naw, I don't think so.
Betsy
---and as always in postings of this nature, it's my opinion and I don't speak for Bodies in them. Gotta stay legal...
Natasha (again)
09-16-03, 03:45 AM
Bush has indeed raped this nation. He is not finished
either, and knowing that troubles me deeply. It really
angers me that he uses the name of God to justify
such evil.
It is because of stuff like this. That even educated and
liberal people will begin to despise me, when they learn
that I am Christian.
Religious bigotry is an insidious evil. It exists in any form
you can imagine, and hypocrisy is the disease of the age.
Natasha
>Was it pure coincidence that the pope and Bush spoke out against gay marriage within hours of eachother earlier this summer? Naw, I don't think so.<
Now, THAT is definitely on the papal agenda. The Vatican has launched a campaign to make gay "marriage" illegal. They have long held that sex is only for the sake of procreation and, of course, people like me should not have sex at all since I can't procreate. For an odd reason, they don't think that heterosexual people are included even if they can't procreate and don't always have sex for the purpose of having offspring and don't always do it in the "approved" fashion. It's been the position of the Vatican and so-called fundamentalist Christians for as long as I can remember. Now the vatican has made it its special mission to get laws passed banning gay unions everywhere. It burns them that a number of nations in the European union and Canada have legalized it. And worse yet that the Poles have too!
DOMA is already in effect here. That was passed under Clinton. Now they want to pass the idiotic Marriage Amendment so that gay unions will be banned for at least years to come. The wording itself does not make gay unions illegal, but I think they are hoping that the courts will interpret it that way.
A number of transsexual attorneys think it is a crazy notion because "man" and "woman" have not been legally defined. And if every person who is now or will be checked for being of the right sex to be married, for whatever definition they decide on, who knows what they will find. Marriages that have been approved would have to be annulled. And... And... And... Things aren't always what they seem. And the whole thing would be a joke.
Bye for now....
Natasha,
I'm educated and liberal and I certainly don't despise you!
You've got a lot of people in your corner and don't you
forget it!
Love,
Dawn
Natasha (again)
09-16-03, 05:18 AM
It so good to hear that. I have taken allot of
severe flak and out right denouncements, by
those who were my friends until they found
out I am Christian.
I am left between a rock and a hard place.
My Pagan and other non Christian ex friends,
lump me in with the right wing Xians.
The vatican does not have a thing to do with
me, and the king of the fake christin right
Reagan? I am totally opposed to him and all
he stands for. You can read what I wrote
earlier in this thread to see who I FIRMLY
believe he is. The Antichrist himself.
It offends me to core of my being, and it
tears my heart out. To see Jesus smeared
by the Devil's servants in using His name
to justify their evil.
It is the greatest insult.
Whew, Betsy!
I think I am beginning to understand Reaganomics. (And that's scary!) It's wishful thinking!
Of course the numbers would bewilder me too. Poor GW. With numbers like that I would be so scared about where I would put the decimal point.
I wish you wouldn't be so hard about Ronny, Natasha. Nancy has tried for many years to put on a happy face for him. And, think! We survived all those years while he was pretending to run the country. It was his best acting job.
Of course, Ronald wasn't as sweet about his bumbling as Gerald was.
The presidents' makeup artists since Richard really should be praised. Does George dye his hair? Is he trying to look more like Clinton? He imitates Reagan really well. His off-the-cuff statements must embarrass his wife no end.
Tata!
Natasha (again)
09-16-03, 02:44 PM
Originally posted by uriela
I wish you wouldn't be so hard about Ronny, Natasha. Nancy has tried for many years to put on a happy face for him. And, think! We survived all those years while he was pretending to run the country.
Yes we survived, but many others did not, and many many
more will die, as a direct result of his actions.
If you believe the Gulf Wars are unjust, then consider
that Reagan made it all possible. This takeover was
planned long ago, and really begun during his admin.
Reagan put Hussein into power. Our current secretary of
defense, Donald Rumsfeld, was sent to the Gulf personally
by Reagan to accomplish that, and a few other things
Remember Iran Contra gate? Reagan sold weapons of mass
destruction to Iran, and gave them to Iraq. Amazing how
Saddam Husein was wise enough to get ride of them. The
Bush admin is a bit taken back that they can't find them
now. All of this stuff was planned in advance. Oh, BTW,
Asama Bin Lauden was recruited, trained and armed by
the US also. Odd how they can't seem to find him isn't it?
Reagan ordered the construction of the weapons currently
being used in the Gulf wars. Those tanks, Hummers etc.,
were built during Reagan's term. He had them all painted
desert camo. He order the stealth bomber and fighter also.
Oh yeah, invisible to radar. Well neither were ever invisible
to either Russian or Chinese radar defense systems. Both
of those stealth planes were built specifically to get
through those radar screens in the Gulf states. They are
also BTW updated versions, of Nazi concept combat
aircraft prototypes.
Remember how Reagan changed our military's helmets to
closely resemble those worn by the Nazi's in WW2?
Remember Reagan's speech at Ber·gen-Belsen, that so
outraged people. He spoke just a little too kindly, nearly
openly affectionate even of the Nazis.
Did you know that Prescott Bush. The grandfather of Bush
Jr, was found guilty by congress in 1944 of violating the
Trading With The Enemy Act? The profit he made in so
doing which was considerable. confiscated, he was
nearly imprisoned.
Prescott Bush was The OBC exec who managed the Third
Reich's money, and he made them solvent enough to
wage WW2. It is all in the Library Of Congress.
Reagan was the president of the screen actors guild during
the McCarthy hearings. He was a close buddy of McCarthy
and Nixon, who was also involved in the so called
"commie Jew" purge of Hollywood. That's right. It was
mainly Jewish people whose lives were destroyed.
Reagan was up to his ears in all of that. As an in insider,
the president of the screen actors guild no less. He was
an immense help to McCarthy and Nixon.
Did you know that the actor Errol Flynn, a now known Nazi
SS double agent, was a close friend of Reagan? Did you
know that Reagan was also a close friend of El Ron Hubbard?
There is so much more, but space will not permit. One thing
is certain. Reagan has really been very skillful in causing
people to grossly underestimate him. His best acting is
really the role of nice guy, and sleepy old harmless actor.
One of The Devil's greatest accomplishments, is that almost
no one really believes he exists.
claraJane
09-16-03, 04:32 PM
Hey Natasha,
It's good to have you back. :)
Betsy, I'm a little surprised to see such venom on a support site and especially on a non-profit. Whatever people think of past or present leaders it seems a shame to drive people away from such a great site by sponsoring threads like this one.
I'm not proposing censorship nor am I even suggesting that people shouldn't share their feelings about whatever they please. I'm just suggesting that there are plenty of more appropriate places to discuss politics.
Isn't it wonderful that we still have the right to do so in this country?
Kind regards,
cjs
Natasha (again)
09-16-03, 05:04 PM
Certainly many have noticed a similar modus operandi,
and even "style", but are there any concrete reasons
to wonder if there is a conncetion? The answer is yes,
and here in part is why.
Firstly lets consider a few basics. Since this is all
about perspective, let's alter our own a bit first.
Anti-semitism was a key component of Nazism, but
did the leaders of the Reich really believe that Jews
were sub human, inferior intellectually and morally?
Ask yourself if the Nazi leadership, with some very
well educated and also smart people among them.
Those who for example built the most advanced
weaponry of their time, invented cloning, etc.,
could have failed to notice that Jews are very well
represented in the arts and sciences? They were
aware of Einstein for example certainly.
I do not believe for one minute that they believed
Jews are inferior. They were merely capitalizing on
existing ethic prejudices and fear. Antisemitism,
homophobia and fear of communism, were exploited
and merely employed as political devices.
The economic devastation following WW1 was
blamed on Jewish Bankers. The social instability
endemic to any nation during a depression, was
blamed on other convenient targets also in
addition to Jews.
Namely gay and other "different people" including
transgender and intersex, and also leftist intellectuals.
Who are today referred to as "liberals", with the
same venomous disdain as they were by Nazis then.
These devices are used by Fascist regimes to divide
and conquer the minds, of the people they seek to
control.
Any device they can imagine is used by them to
divide and conquer, including also religious bigotry.
Here at home the unseen power that was behind
the rise of the Third Reich, is employing the same
tactics they used then.
The MO is more than merely similar, and so it is not
merely coincidental. The FBI, Interpol and Scotland
Yard have long known. That to discover the identity
of any criminal, you must study their mode of
operation, because such is signatory. How a crime
is committed, speaks volumes about who committed
the crime, and this is also fundamental in suspect
profiling.
Considering the vast complexity of the amount of
planning, in addition to the considerable political
influence as well as economic clout it took, to
rebuild Germany from it's post war state of
economic depression. It is clear that the Nazis had
allot of help from outside of Germany.
For one thing they were broke. Money poured in
from overseas, most notably from several American
industrialists, including Henry Ford.
As well, the grandfather of our current President,
Prescott Bush was an executive of the OBC, a
large international Bank. He was an overseas
investment portfolio manager, and he handled the
account of the Third Reich. He was even found guilty
before the US Congress, of being in violation of the
Trading With The Enemy Act, back in 1944. The large
profit he made, in making the Nazis rich enough to
build their military up and invade Poland, were
confiscated and he was very nearly imprisoned.
Henry Ford, who was known to be admirer of Hitler,
donated vast sums of money to rebuild Germany's
economy. In exchange for being allowed to build
and operate factories to make machine parts, and
auto assembly plants. All of which operated
throughout WW2 producing weapons of mass
destruction.
The SS had operatives throughout Great Brittan
and the USA, and among them was the movie
star Errol Flynn, who was a very close friend
and well known associate, of ex President Ronald
Wilson Reagan.
One other small thing. The infamous secret society
headquartered at Yale University, known as the
Scull and Bones Society. Has among it's many
members both ex President George Bush Sr and
George Bush Jr. Others members include some high
ranking Nazis, who attended Yale before the war.
The signet seal of the Scull and Bones Society is
oddly enough identical to the same used by the
Nazi SS. What a coincidence.
Natasha
Natasha (again)
09-16-03, 05:12 PM
Originally posted by claraJane
Hey Natasha,
It's good to have you back. :)
Betsy, I'm a little surprised to see such venom on a support site and especially on a non-profit. Whatever people think of past or present leaders it seems a shame to drive people away from such a great site by sponsoring threads like this one.
I'm not proposing censorship nor am I even suggesting that people shouldn't share their feelings about whatever they please. I'm just suggesting that there are plenty of more appropriate places to discuss politics.
Isn't it wonderful that we still have the right to do so in this country?
Kind regards,
cjs
Yes, isn't it wonderful that we still have the right to
speak our minds?
I have to ask you though Clara. Who would be driven
away because some criticize Bush and Reagan? I
also would really like to know what the non profit
status of this place has to do with this.
Thanks for the welcome back. I am glad to know you
are glad I am back, saying controversial things you
dislike being discussed. Warms my heart really,
Natasha
claraJane
09-16-03, 05:43 PM
Hey Natasha,
Who would be driven away? And what does that have to do with being a non-profit?
Non-profits tend to be financed by donations. Most non-profits try to appeal to a broad spectrum of people. Most are pretty careful about offending people unnecessarily.
Non-profits usually have a well-defined charter that states the purpose of the organization. Sufficient deviation from that charter can result in the IRS pulling their non-profit status. This is especially true when it comes to politics. The use of non-profit donations for political purposes is strictly regulated.
I'm no expert on non-profit law but it seems reasonable to limit the threads to those that at least have some plausable relationship to the charter.
If you really believe in a vast right-wing conspiracy doesn't it make sense to try to protect this site against it?
cjs
Natasha (again)
09-16-03, 06:10 PM
>Hey Natasha,
Who would be driven away? And what does that have to do with being a non-profit?
Non-profits tend to be financed by donations. Most non-profits try to appeal to a broad spectrum of people. Most are pretty careful about offending people unnecessarily.
Non-profits usually have a well-defined charter that states the purpose of the organization. Sufficient deviation from that charter can result in the IRS pulling their non-profit status. This is especially true when it comes to politics. The use of non-profit donations for political purposes is strictly regulated.
I'm no expert on non-profit law but it seems reasonable to limit the threads to those that at least have some plausable relationship to the charter.
If you really believe in a vast right-wing conspiracy doesn't it make sense to try to protect this site against it?
cjs <
I am not so sure that the IRS regulations you refer
to, preclude those on a forum provided by an
organization with non profit status, from discussing
their political opinions though Clara.
If that is the case, then the very fundamental nature
of this entire organization could easily be 'construed'
as political. Since it is a political act to seek to change
the national medical protocol through education etc.
If so why the IRS granted BLO NPS is a real wonder
then isn't it?
Certainly there are those in the Bush administration
who would pull such a dirty trick though. I am sure
that even some of the BA's supporters would try to
use that against us.
But do you really think anyone here would? Surely
not Clara. <tsk> <tsk>
So really then, unless 'you' Clara believe in
"vast right wing conspiracies" as you put it.
There is nothing to worry about is there?
I mean you just wouldn't be trying to scare us
into being silent on this issue would you? Of
course not.
Natasha
Taking in everyone's concerns and seeing good points on both sides, I have taken the liberty of moving this thread to what I hope will be a more appropriate place.
ClaraJane, the IRS rules concern lobbying, not discussion such as thins. Actually, all non-profits can devote a certain portion of resources and time (25%) to lobbying etc. However, I understand your point quite well, and think it is a very good point concerning support vs alienation due to differing views. It's also why I make very clear in off-topic posts that the opinions are solely my own.
I also think that support goes beyond just talking about IS issues and talking about our world, our lives, etc.
So, with that in mind and some thought about what to do based upon everyone's comments was to create a Speak Your Mind Catagory for stuff our members feel is important but not necessarily related to the topic at hand. I don't feel stifling opinions is a good thing, and given that we weren't asked our opinion about our future which is the premise of this organizaiton.
By having it's own separate catagory, it will not intrude into the areas that people look to for emotional and otherwise, support.
Betsy
Natasha (again)
09-16-03, 06:58 PM
Having an opinion and a desire to express it is
part of human nature, and so part of life.
I have read at many forums. Both those which
respect freedom of speech, and those that do
not.
I watched many come and go, and those which
stifle opinions and or practice censorship, never
seem to last long.
Simply because it remains possible for me to
say what I have here about this. In no way
proves that what I have said is false. For I
have not said that we no longer have any
freedom of speech.
We have some, for now, but that will change.
Natasha
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