wmfp--weekend edition

[Betsy]

Nope...no wanna fucks this week. It kind of makes it boring.

But as posted elsewhere:

What's WMFP?
All of them? Last week, I was grateful to have none. What a difference a week makes!

After getting pulled over on an expired registration via a simple plate check, I went to get plates today. The NJ DMV website said they were only closed on legal holidays. But nooooo...they were closed for a long weekend.

Then, I head to the bus station and grab a bus into NYC thinking I was due in for some work at 10am, but when I got there, discovered that I am actually due in tomorrow at 10am.

Between getting off the bus and getting to work, I stopped for an egg sandwich and I swear the deli got the eggs on the roll by tossing them from about 5 feet away with the roll as the target. When I opened it up, it was so poorly wrapped and constructed, one half ended up on the sidewalk but only after bouncing off my jeans and shoes on the way there. The eggs were over-easy btw.

I ate what was left, headed back to the PABT and got on the bus to come home, $30 bucks poorer.

I figured it was best to remain indoors at home the rest of the day.

[Morgan]

I got one :(

Two batches of endo tests, and the invoice for the second batch just arrived in the post today:

27 October:
Glucose, LFT, LH, Prolactin, FSH, E2, Testosterone, SHBG, TSH
Cost: Aus$ 174.65

29 November:
Glucose, LFT, LH, Prolactin, FSH, E2, Testosterone, SHBG
Cost: Aus$ 235 (US$ 173)

The difference? Just over one month, one test less, but more than A$60 extra (US$44)

How do they make these numbers up? My insurance won't cover a pre-existing condition until next September, and I can't query it until Monday when the accounts department opens.

[prince....ss?]

Hello Morgan,

Hmmm…well now….ok perhaps this will make you feel a bit better.

My endo visit.

Initial appointment........ $300.00
Venipuncture............... $ 14.58
Comp Metabolic panel .... $ 62.61
FSH,SERUM ................. $117.19
LH.............................. $117.19
T4, TOTAL................... $ 41.63
TSH............................ $111.35
CBC w/ Diff &PLT........... $ 47.91

GRAND TOTAL...............$812.46

This afternoon I will go back and get the results of the testing so I guess I need another $300 .

I am self employed and health insurance is something that I don’t have so every dime comes out of my own pocket. I do work hard for this money.

Gee all that money to find that he wants to put me back on Premarin and Provera the shit that made me insane during my 20’s.

Well perhaps I should act like some people I know and sit on the street corner with a sign saying “ WILL WORK FOR MEDICAL TREATMENT” does begging really work? Hmmm….I would hate to degrade myself like that.

Hope that make you feel a bit better.
Prince….ss?

[Dana Gold]

Initial consulatations are always more expensive than follow-up visits; expect appx $100 to pay for your next.

As for the Premarin (horse-piss xeno-estrogen, which has minute amounts of testosterone metabolite) and Provera (medroxyprogesterone acetate, a progestin and not a progesterone!) ....ask for molecularly similar (to human body: estrogen like Estrace (which is actually cheaper than Premarin....and Prometrium (micronized progesterone).

Clinical studies have indicated Premarin and Provera to be the culprits behind many adverse effects which has been in the news recently. For the estrogen route of administration, Estrace (17-B-estradiol may be taken sub-lingually or use patches (17-B-estradiol)...avoids hepatic first-pass effect and lessens vascular/hepatic negative side effects. The byword with any hormones is to havethem enter the body the same way Nature intended.....through the bloodstream first....not the stomach; and they should be chemically similar to waht the body produces from its "sources".

Dana

[Meadow]

Dana,

Yes, I concur on Premarin being probably one's last choice of estrogen type hormone replacement. Estradiol, as you mentioned, is better and less expensive. Also, as you indicated, avoiding going through the stomach and hence the liver helps eliminate some of the adverse side effects. Patches, sub lingual, or injections are preferable.

What caught my attention in your post, however, was use of 17-b-Estradiol. I had begun using that in combo with progresterone and really did not have many feminizing effects. When I started using estradiol cypionate, wow, THAT made a difference! I also had good luck with estradiol valerate, but it was a lot more expensive. Dana, what would be the difference between the 17-b and the others? Is there a difference in the target tissues? What I do now for hormone replacement is 1 mg estradiol cypionate IM once a week. I don't worry with the progesterone, as I don't have a uterus to get cancerous.

Yes, the lab costs and endo costs just seem out of control. What is sad is that these things are all done on the animal side for a whole lot less. Is the quality of the tests lower? No. Animal labs use the same procedures and quality standards. Its just they don't mark them up as much. That is why I make about 20% of what a physician does. Oh well . . .

Prince....ss?, I'm sorry that you have to shell out so much for that stuff. I got hit with a big endo bill about a year ago and it took me 6 months to pay it off. Somedays ya just feel like getting up and handing money to everyone you see. At the end of the day, you're still broke, but at least some of those who got your money might be deserving.

Meadow

[Dana Gold]

Well, as you know there are 3 estrogens (estradiol, estrone, and estiol). 17-B-estradiol (E2) is the most potent of the three. You seemed to have the best effects with the cypionate form ....core 17-B-estradiol same just conjugated with the injection medium (oil, whatever). I take 1 mg micronized estradiol only (unconjugated with any medium) once in the AM; once in PM Because of my idiopathic (unknown etiology) hypergonadotropic hypogonadism (relatively weak gonadal response to high gonadotropin levels) and with the sublingual administration I have rreached E2 peak plasma levels of 200 +/- 30 (what?..(egad! I forgot the exact units!...numbers are right , though)) pg/ml; which has been just right for me and which results in (negative fedback) of 40-50 pg/dl total testosterone from low 300s prior , free testosterone, from 11 to 1.2 ...and gonadotropins: LH 28-30 usual & FSH mid to high 30's usual prior ...both dropped to about 8 U/L (? units) after E2...I do not want the E2 (and especially the major metabolite estrone) to linger in my body...sublingual for me = rapid absorption -> tissue receptors, and relatively faster clearance (than the other estrogens) of estrone and conversion to weak estriol which has no negative effects at all.....plus the sub-administration levels are "normal female ". I have to be careful with elevated E2 levels (some TS have up to 500 or more plasma levels!); I was given tumor marker tests initial visit to endo to monitor and rule out gonadal and breast cancer (I had some breasts before E2 admisistration...wide hips/pear shape already had prior ,too.) As far as feminization: mine has been satisfactory since I was already "looking a bit that way" prior to E2 Tx...

It's a matter of individual results, what worked for you and for me are 2 different "ballgames"....as it is with evryone else....there is not a standart Tx regimen for transitioning, as you know.

And differences in target tissues?...shouldn't be, unless differences in receptor viability and quantity are an issue in the individual's body.


Anyway....gotta go; suddenly busy at work....and the InterNet (and this Forum site) are sloooow.

Dana

[Dana Gold]

17-b-Estradiol. I had begun using that in combo with progresterone

Progesterone has a relationship in E2 production; maybe the progesterone down-regulated the E2 or metabolized it quicker? Progesterone craem is used by some women to lessen estrogen dominance.

Anyway, we both got where we wanted to go, eh?...

Dana....

[Morgan]

Hi Prince...ss, Dana and Meadow

I guess that this _does_ make me feel better. Those of us outside the US hear about how good the US health system is supposed to be - if you have money and health insurance. We also hear about how drugs cost more because of the cost of doing research - but I guess that just doesn't apply to blood tests. And, with the exception of testo patches, the other stuff I use (when I can be bothered) is developed in Europe. My thoughts? The costs of litigation and sales reps might have something to do with it, but really it shows that you pay what the market will bear. That's capitalism.

In the rest of the west, health services are not fully a free market, they're regulated and we pay a lot more for our health systems as part of our taxes. When I'm here in Australia long enough, most of my costs will be covered for that reason. Just as they were in Ireland and the UK, when I lived in those places.

Right now, I pay all of the costs, over A$1,300 in 2.5 months, US$962, plus what I pay for health insurance (I pay it, not my employer) which is causing me a bit of pain, but your comments make me glad I live here, not where you are...

all the best

Morgan

[CC]

27 October:
Cost: Aus$ 174.65
29 November:
Cost: Aus$ 235 (US$ 173)
The difference? Just over one month, one test less, but more than A$60 extra (US$44)
How do they make these numbers up? My insurance won't cover a pre-existing condition until next September

Morgan,you will have to become an Aussie mate,I am sorry but its the only sane solution.In comparrison to you,we both attend the same doctor (Dr Hayes) my blood tests are free of charge,the doctors consultation fees are the same as your's,only I get a rebate from Medicare and my out of pocket expences end up about 30 bucks.

Now,tell me that makes you feel better :aargh:

Later my friend

C

[Betsy]

if you have money and health insurance.

Make that lots and lots and lots of money. The state of health care in the US is in a near crisis due to rising premiums for those lucky enough to have it through employers, and there are 25 million uninsured in the US. Actually, it may be 45 million.

If you have a pre-existing condition, it's damn near impossible to find individual health insurance.

Medical mistakes are an ongoing and increasing problem due to the pressure from doctors to treat as many patients as they can in a day because the insurance companies--while charging the insured outrageous premiums--are constantly reducing the amount they reimburse them.

I know many people who have left the United States because of the health care situation. In fact, an article I wrote on another site is being included in a book by some France-residing expats about why they left due to the health care situation here.

[prince....ss?]

Well Dana you were right on the money!!!(not sure if that is a pun or not) The visit at the endo was $120 so my total out of pocket experience is $932.46.

I feel that the money would have been better spent on my truck. Hmmmm…what was I thinking. That could have been a full round of tires and breaks. Ok I’ve learned my lesson.

Well I don’t have a clue as to the exchange between Dana and Meadow, stuff that I will never understand, you both sure can make one feel small minded. But that is one of the reasons that I have staked my position in the ground and time will tell if it was a correct decision. But it is nice to know that I could ask a simple question of should or shouldn’t and you can put all that stuff together and give me the simplified version so that I can make decisions. Thanks.

My lab results all came back as normal, or what was expected. Everything was where is should be except my hormone levels( gee, no kidding) I have none!!!

So my decision is to take the Fosamax for a year or two and retest the bone density thing and make the decision at that point if I should continue that treatment.

I will not start any hormones of any kind. I don’t need them and I don’t want them. So end of story.

So tomorrow I take my first Fosamax pill, the doc gave me a three month sample supply. I hope it won’t burn out my stomach or make me go blind or something…Magic pills scare me to no end.

I think I like this endo. In his free time he likes to run a bull dozer pushing big rocks and trees around. My kind of people!!!

Prince….ss?

[Sofie]

What is sad is that these things are all done on the animal side for a whole lot less. Is the quality of the tests lower? No. Animal labs use the same procedures and quality standards. If you're really desperate, would it be possible to have a blood test done for your uhm "horse"?

[Meadow]

Uh, while I'll never admit to anything, uh, well, hmmm, I suppose I MIGHT have had an alias or two. ;) ;) Stomp Stomp Stomp!!

[Dana Gold]

Uh, while I'll never admit to anything, uh, well, hmmm, I suppose I MIGHT have had an alias or two. Stomp Stomp Stomp!!
Oh, Gee....and here all along I thought you perhaps were your own phlebotomist and the "lab tech" who ran your own diagnostics panels.:wink_smil
So tomorrow I take my first Fosamax pill, the doc gave me a three month sample supply. I hope it won’t burn out my stomach or make me go blind or something…Magic pills scare me to no end.
Here is some info in "layman's" terms to "enlighten":idea2: you about this med, so you won't be scared of it:

http://www.pdrhealth.com/drug_info/rxdrugprofiles/drugs/fos1185.shtml

PS: Oh, and don't "wash it down" with a pint of "suds":rolleye13

Take care ya'll:regular_s

:pizza: