View Full Version : Walking on Eggshells...
Billie Q.
03-23-04, 04:11 PM
I passed a guy on the courthouse steps today: "Good morning" I said brightly. "What do you mean, 'good morning'?" he railed, "how the hell can you call it a 'good morning'? You don't know what I've been through!"
I stood flabbergasted, searching my mind for an appropriate reply to his outburst. "Sir, it has been customary in American society since its inception to greet someone in passing" I told him in a tone I hoped would diffuse his sputtering rage. "American society?" he yelled, "How can you presume to speak for American society?" At this, he drew a pistol.
I feared I would die for the cause of "political correctness."
PS This scenario never happened. However, I fear someday soon, things may reach this point...
I hate to be the one to say it, but I think you're too late. About 12 years ago here, the thing for gang initiations was to drive at night with the headlights off. Then, when some poor samaritan blinked his/her lights to let the driver know, they would then follow and kill the individual trying to be helpful.
It seems more and more here, the trend is to make niceness and a desire to assist others a crime. Will the polite greeting of this century be a fist to the face?
Billie Q.
03-24-04, 07:46 AM
Andi,
What a sad commentary on our American society.
You are so right -- a polite greeting in Atlanta has become a rape, a murder or a carjacking.
Youi cannot look someone in the eye on a downtown Atlanta street -- you risk your personal safety to do so. When you ignore people on metro-Atlanta's public transit system, or try to avoid them/maintain your personal safe space, you are called many names, and you fear for your life.
This is real -- and is no joke.
Dana Gold
03-24-04, 11:32 AM
Violence in society has always been a fact of life. Whether active (physical: assault/murder/rape) or passive (degrading/demeaning words and actions) it remains a problem not just in America, but around the world. Although we may lament the sad state of the world, what do we/can we really do about it? An analogy of the pebble in the pond may suffice to exemplify the individual human being's (pebble)effect on the environment (pond).
Mahatma Ghandi once said "You must be the change you wish to see in the world."
This small phrase carries a lot of weight. If the "pond" is already polluted with violence, then we only add to it by creating and "contributing" our active and passive violence to our individual environments. On a greater level; there are movements to stem the tide of and educate people on a large scale to the phenomena of human violence. I would like to share a website with you all with the intent to show that "something is being done about it". Many people feel powerless and apathetic about the state of affiairs on our planet. Having been a victim of both active and passive violence, I have made the determination to value my own life and that of other human beings, for this is where it all starts....the self. And that will explain to you all why I am so very avid (sometimes more so) about , not just tolerance, but acceptance of each human being's reality and dignity. And this does not imply a permissiveness toward wrong-doing (crime etc) as some may venture to think. The issue here is not a political one but a social and environmental one. Anyway, here it is; .the site refers mostly to youth, one of the more "valuable resources" of our (and any) country:
PS: There are other Victory over Violence movements/sites, I just happen to have knowledge of and been part of this one.
http://www.vov.com/
"You are either part of the problem, or part of the solution"
- 1960's activism slogan -
Dana Gold
03-24-04, 07:16 PM
I posted a relevant reply, applicable to this thread, under 'Fighting Gender Stereotypes'...I'm not that naive to think that everyone in this world may have the same benevolence and respect as I and others aspire to have and implement in daily life affairs.
Billie Q.
03-24-04, 07:23 PM
Dana Gold wrote "I have made the determination to value my own life and that of other human beings. . . I am so very avid about. . . acceptance of each human being's reality and dignity."
And that determination will make you a target. Guaranteed. Carry pepper spray, and/or a gun. Good luck.
I think that we have had enough posts mentioning either guns or pistols for one day.
As an intersex person, who was once forced to quit a job because of a death threat involving guns, I do not take any mention of guns lightly, even if only on a "fantasy" level.
I think that it is important for intersex people to feel a sense of safety when posting to this forum, and I don't think that mentioning guns, even if it might be well intentioned, helps this forum.
It is also condescending for non-intersex people to tell intersex people that they should arm themselves.
Peter
Billie Q.
03-24-04, 10:08 PM
Originally posted by ptrinkl108
It is also condescending for non-intersex people to tell intersex people that they should arm themselves.
Peter
I wasn't speaking as a "non-intersex" person to an "intersex" person, and you should not assume that, nor should you attempt to twist my words, or the meaning or intent of my post.
I advocate EVERYONE in urban areas such as Atlanta carry weapons. Especially people who have been victims of violent crime, or who might be victims of violent crime.
You got a problem with that?
You got a problem with that?
Yes, I do. Street justice and paranoia solves nothing. Should we schedule armed showdowns to see who has the bigger gun.
I've lived in Atlanta, I work in NYC (in Hell's Kitchen---not really the best part of town), and in Norfolk VA I lived in the absolute worst part of town. Never once have I felt that I needed to arm myself, nor have I ever felt threatened. Now in Easton, I learned from a police officer who I met just this evening that I live in the "worst part of town"
My response was, "Really? Everyone seems really nice and they are much friendlier than were I lived in NJ" The part of NJ I lived in had the highest income per capita in the country ( I brought it down significantly)---but people there were most unfriendly.
Should I have armed myself to protect myself against that perceived unfriendliness?
Advocating violence or potential violence is a horrible thing to do.
Betsy
About 12 years ago here, the thing for gang initiations was to drive at night with the headlights off. Then, when some poor samaritan blinked his/her lights to let the driver know, they would then follow and kill the individual trying to be helpful.
Urban legend. See any of the many urgan websites for proof that there is not a single incidence of this happening.
Snopes is one that is easy to navigate: http://www.snopes.com/horrors/madmen/lightout.asp
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Billy Q said:
"How the hell can you call it a 'good morning'? You don't know what I've been through!"
"How can you presume to speak for American society?" At this, he drew a pistol.
I feared I would die for the cause of "political correctness."
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Jules says:
These statements have nothing at all to do with "political correctness".
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Billy Q said:
I advocate EVERYONE in urban areas such as Atlanta carry weapons.
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Jules says:
If you advocate that you have guns you make yourself a huge target for gun thieves. Most guns used in crimes are stolen from people who thought it was safe to claim that they had guns or advocated for them. It is a very dangerous thing to advocate for people to carry guns even just around yur city: Maybe you should rethink that. :mad:
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Billy Q Says:
You should not assume that, nor should you attempt to twist my words, or the meaning or intent of my post.
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Jules says:
We, the BLO team, do not twist words. we just react to them.
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BETSY SAID:
Advocating violence or potential violence is a horrible thing to do.
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Jules said: I could not have said it any better.
I am hoping that this forum can get back to the basics of support for intersex people and their allies. I was just reading over an old thread from the beginning of this year, and noticed how supportive everyone seemed to be of BillieQ's medical situation. A couple of months ago, the general atmosphere at this forum seemed to be more friendly.
Can there be some sort of time-out?
Group dynamics can be complex, and I can not claim to have a very good understanding of the underlying group dynamics here at this forum. However, escalating posts into flames and responses to flames does not seem to be too constructive.
I personally could fan the flames. I have many strong opinions. But is having strong opinions always constructive if these opinions cannot be expressed in a supportive environment?
I think that we have to take into account that the internet is an environment where personal face to face interaction is not usually (except video conferencing) possible. One poster recently expressed the fear of personal harm. Betsy has assured me that everyone is safe based upon her knowledge of people at this forum. The invisibility of posters on the internet can lead to fears for one's safety, especially if topics like "guns" surface.
Last week, I had dinner with David Cameron of ISNA, and hanging out with another intersex person and casually talking face to face about intersex issues is very different than reading posts. It's easier to feel the support.
I suggest that as a starting point, that we try to return to posts about topics immediately related to intersex issues. IQ tests, grammar issues, posts based upon urban legands, and the like may be interesting(or not). Personally, I view these issues as tangential to the core purpose of this forum, which is intersex support.
Peter
Billie Q.
03-26-04, 08:04 AM
Originally posted by Betsy
Yes, I do. Street justice and paranoia solves nothing. Should we schedule armed showdowns to see who has the bigger gun.
Bets, I am so glad you've not been raped, physically assaulted (twice), burglarized, pickpocketed, or auto burglarized (three times).
I have. I will hurt someone before I am assaulted again. I do not carry a gun, because I do not have a concealed weapon permit; I do however, ON OCCASION carry pepper spray.
Your remarks remind me of Gays who say "I've never been Gay-bashed" (I have -- numerous incidents). It feels like victim-blame.
Guns and weapons have their place. I never advocated "street justice."
Billie Q.
03-26-04, 08:07 AM
Originally posted by ptrinkl108
I am hoping that this forum can get back to the basics of support for intersex people and their allies.
Hey Peter, perhaps you overlooked the title of THIS forum and its stated purpose:
"Use this space for non-support issues and stuff unrelated to intersex issues. The opinions expressed here belong solely to the author and do not represent the opinions of Bodies Like Ours."
Your remarks and those of some other folks here, remind me of Gays who only see the world thru "Gay-colored" glasses. There is a whole world out there beyond IS, you know...
Dana Gold
03-26-04, 12:23 PM
Dear Billie,
You have, as everybody does, the right to defend yourself. And I understand your anger because I've been through that (abuse, assault, and harassment) many times, too. Maybe I'm a "peace-nik" now, but I was NOT a few years back. I held the same (but s/w different) view as you: my mantra: if I "go down", I WILL take someone with me!
Now, let's talk reality: When I was in the military (drafted into/1970), they taught us one thing: when you are in a combat-zone, you must remain level-headed (yeah, right:rolleyes: ); a good defense is a controlled one.... be "on guard" but not "off-balance".... Although you may walk with heated anger amongst the denizens of "the jungle", realize: that very same aura may be an attractant to the gangsters and thugs who are looking for a fight, and that mood may put you "off balance" for any proper defense. If you EVER get a handgun; then you must learn how to use it and know the laws that pertain to firearms; local police depts may have such training... and firing ranges for practice. Learn the proper handling of your pepper spray...I DO carry at all times a pocket-sized cannister of mace/pepper spray (it's legal). Or as an alternative; enroll in a martial arts class and learn the art of self-defense.
OR if the place you live is THAT "hairy", is there a way to get the h*ll "out of Dodge"?
Please understand that I am not advocating you go into "combat mode", because once you find yourself "in the sh*t", I need not have to tell you, the price to pay may be more than you can "afford"...i.e. get into a "firefight"; expect to be wounded or worse. Police and soldiers don't go through all that training for nothing.
AND...the phrase "war is hell" doesn't apply just to battleground conflict or the "asphalt jungle". You can have war inside you....a seething presence that eats a person from the inside out...although the things you have suffered are heavy on you; it may be helpful to find some peace within (as I have been trying to do)....it is hard, I know, but....it is your body and mind...maybe it's time to heal the wounds first before you go back out "into the field"....does a vacation from the "war-zone" sound like a good idea?...an actual trip to the seaside, the mountains, to get "awayfrom it all" for a recuperative period of time...some R&R?
PS: I did not say the above through "rose-colored" glasses; I'm a "veteran" of what you talked about and said what I did from that perspective. Take care,
"War does not determine who is right - only who is left."
-Bertrand Russell
Lastly: a bit of "wit":
"I believe everybody in the world should have guns. Citizens should have bazookas and rocket launchers too. I believe that all citizens should have their weapons of choice. However, I also believe that only I should have the ammunition. Because frankly, I wouldn't trust the rest of the goobers with anything more dangerous than string."
-Scott Adams
"anything more dangerous than string"
Make that JELLO, instead of string,!!:rolleyes:
"The problems that exist in the world today cannot be solved by the level of thinking that created them."
-Albert Einstein
"Use this space for non-support issues and stuff unrelated to intersex issues. The opinions expressed here belong solely to the author and do not represent the opinions of Bodies Like Ours."
No, but it cannot be used to advocate violence or possibly illegal activities. Continuing to do so will result in posting privilages being removed or placed on moderation.
Your remarks remind me of Gays who say "I've never been Gay-bashed" (I have -- numerous incidents). It feels like victim-blame.
You are advocating violence and that is enough to cause concern. Be part of the solution, not the problem.
Your remarks and those of some other folks here, remind me of Gays who only see the world thru "Gay-colored" glasses. There is a whole world out there beyond IS, you know...
Yes there is, and world that is ugly in many aspects, so therefore this is considered "safe space" I wish it were real space and someday it might even be. Advocating violence does not belong in "safe spaces"
I am a totally out person as lesbian and IS. My number is all over the internet. I don't feel as if I am in danger. I think most feelings of being in danger is nothing more than paranoia. You know how animal experts say animals can sense fear and use it. I believe it is the same with miscreants---if you only crack the door and peak out in fear, expect to have them taking advantage.
Open the door and invite them in for tea and you may be surprised by who you meet.
Betsy
cougar9q
04-04-04, 07:03 PM
I am going to say this....
Disarm America.
Yes I am going against Amendment two...but I feel like we should declare that unconstitutional by repealing it.
I may put my foot in my mouth later, but I will keep on..
Also I feel that we Americans should demand to reduce the amount of violence that is in the popular culture. Not a ban but a moderate amount less.
Is this wrong and narrow?
Maybe.....
This "violent" media, is also the beautiful media that depicts and shows the superiorness of "slim, skinny, super model type women" on most of it's programming.
This doesn't necessarilty "make" or force young girls conform to the depictions from the media, but it sadly does influence them.
I could go on and on but that would take forever to give you all of the sexual, social, gender, racial, ethnic, tones the media forces down our throats....
Back to guns....disarm all except for the military.
If any one needs to be protected let it be no one. Not even the police..... There are other ways to "serve and protect people" Maybe the police could use rubber bullets....etc....
Just Thoughts,
Monica
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