Parents should better not trust their doctor?

[mohnblume]

... and the story might not be finished. What could happen to Patrick, when he will be in the puberty and breasts would be growing? I do hope for Patrick that they (Parents and Docs) will talk with him into the depth and will consider his personal wish.

I remember in my case were they all talking about me, but nobody with me. I was just a confused young person, not knowing what happens to me. After several visits with doctors and in hospitals, the breasts were cut off. I have to say, this still happened to Money's time.

And by the way, listen what David Reimer's mother says:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uDb-rNvyzkA

[Dianne]

Originally Posted by mohnblume

I remember in my case were they all talking about me, but nobody with me. I was just a confused young person, not knowing what happens to me.

Yes, exactly! I was the last one to find out what everybody else had known since my birth and I had to find out for myself. But my adopted mom would rather I had committed suicide than defied the mandate of the doctors (but she was sick in the head anyway).

[Kailana]

I was just wondering about patrick these days. i do recall watching this on the tv, many years ago now, 20009-2001, its from the "Is it a boy, or a girl" documentary. I'd imagine patrick to be 10-11 or so by now. My only real comment or question is "what does Patrick say he is is"?

As for the comments by the adoptive parents, I don't really put too much thought into what they percieve as boy type behavior. Kids are kids, particularly when they are that young, and in my experience the only girly girls i had known as a child, were the ones from really restricted families/parents that coddled there kids. For all the rest of us we pretty much behaved alike. Now then it wasnt tell early teens that i really think we socialised as being different. You know, like making the little clicky group, of the people you hang around. Well i really havent got much else to say. just that the utube clip is several yeears old now, at least the airing date, and who knows when it was actually filmed.

[mohnblume]

... so Kailana, what do you want to tell here ... I might be to stupid, but didn't get it.

[Dianne]

It seemed to me that she was saying there isn't behavioral differences between young girls and young boys. That wouldn't be my experience either as a child or as an adult watching children. There may be many with "neutral" behavior but half or more of the children I have known are expressing behavior with a definite leaning by age 5.

I think the general point is that no one has a clear indication of a child's gender until the child his/her self can express it. Again this ties back to our despicable John Money.

[Kailana]

First of all i had to rewatch the documentary, i do have it recorded.

As for what i am trying to say, is that many parents often try to put gender expression into a childs behavior. Kinda like i did everything. Played house/dolls with my sisters, and i playes army with my brother. You know, i think children do really what is around them really. And as for the parents behavior and reaction with a child, its really what they try to provide the child with that can have a influence on there behavior. And yes i know many people will say that this child is behaving as a boy, well what if that is the encouragement that he is recieving from the family. What if he gets shunned or teased when he does anything girly like in behavior. im only bringing up possibilities. I am really just curious how Patrick behaves now? as a young teen.

And the documentary is titled " Gender Unknown", i kinda got that confused, and aired 2001. Sorry about the title mistake.

I just think the parents are making more out of the way patrick behaves at that age. I mean for all i Know Patrick could be one of the most macho, manly boys in the world. I just don't know, but I am very curious, thats all.

Now as for the behavior of the surgeon that took the one testes, from Patrick i am sure that is gonna cause many problems for him. I hope his parents follow through with there words on being open and honest with him. I would love to see a update on how he is doing. I am not much in favor of Dr's choosing for people there gender. And i do believe that Patrick is XY/XO. I think someone asked that in an earlier post. Now then I am far from perfect on anything i say or do. But I do wish Dr's understood all of us, all of our histories kinda say the same thing. Leave us alone, let us decide, its our bodies, what is right for the individual should be up too the individual. Guess thats all i am really saying.

[Dianne]

But I do wish Dr's understood all of us, all of our histories kinda say the same thing. Leave us alone, let us decide, its our bodies, what is right for the individual should be up too the individual. Guess thats all i am really saying.

I think we all feel that way. If anyone disagrees, I would sure like to hear why.

It is also too bad that there are no reliable statistics on what percentage of IS babies are happy with their assignment.

Assigning gender based on measuring the phalis seems as logical as assigning gender based on hair color.