SF Support Groups?

[Dana Gold]

If that's necessary to make you post again.

LOL.... yes, well.....I've always "entered" with a "flourish" , I'd say

Glad to post again ...after several weeks of absence

PS: Hello to everybody in BLO Land

Dana

" A little bit is always better than nothing "

[miriam]

Originally Posted by Priestess

Miriam, how do you know that Princess was loudly demanding entrance to an AIS support group? If you'd ever seen her, you would know that she herself is not a man. She looked more female than Cheryl Chase.

I know that I quietly and politely contacted them simply asking questions about one of the associated conditions their web page implies support for, and was still pushed away. I understand the AIS'ers not understanding non-insensitive folks who might happen to have a uterus and sometimes ovaries yet still set off a y-detector. But if it's AIS only, why not say it? And why support certain selected people who clearly are not AIS?

Priestess, the first word of the line you are referring to is "If". That being said you hit the nail on its head: it is not important how a person looks like, as long as this person can relate to the stories of the other women, someone may fit perfectly in an AIS support group. I've attended meetings in the Netherlands, France, the UK, the USA and Israel. In all those countries there are members who are not the 'beautiful & tall' women that some people see as the stereotype AIS-girl. Unlike common believe many women with AIS are plane janes and not stunning photo models. It's also not true that only women with AIS can become a member of an AIS support group. I know many women in the groups I just mentioned who have another condition like 17BHSD, 5ARD, Sweyer, Leydig Cell Hypoplasia etc. And it is also not true that only women-born-women can become a member of these groups.

But if you don't fit in... well, then you simply don't fit in. You can't blame other people that they can't relate to your story. That sucks, I know.

The real miracle of a peer support group is that the other people in that group need only half a word to understand what you are talking about. If that miracle isn't working for you, the group is not for you. And similar: if other people feel that they don't understand you, even when you use 50 words to explain what you feel, you have to understand that those people don't belong to your group.

I can only hope you believe me when I say that the fact we have xy-chromosomes is not the real common factor that binds women in an AIS support group. Of course, for people without AIS that is the most 'visible' aspect of AIS. But for women with AIS it is more about how you have to deal with that knowledge.

I don't know what you asked, but I think that it is normal that an AIS support group can't give you much information. Every now and them I get letters from people who think that I'm an medical professional and that I can tell diagnose them with an intersex condition. The AIS support groups work with volunteers. Some of them have an academic degree and others don't. Many of them know a lot about the XY intersex conditions. But you can't expect them to know everything about every possible condition IS or not-IS. The main job of the volunteers is to welcome new members and if there is time left we also try to help other people. So, if you say that feel pushed away, it is quite well possible that nobody knew what to answer. Anyway, I don't feel responsible for what other people with or without AIS did to you. So please don't be angry with me.

Groeten, Miriam

[prince....ss?]

All I am saying is the AIS, PAIS men are turned away and told to go elsewhere. So if you offer no assistance then you are in a sense telling them to go fuck themselves.

If you turn all the men away that are AIS or PAIS then there are no men within the organization to facilitate support the men with this condition issues. So to say that no men are there to organize the men’s group is a weak defense being that you don’t allow men in the first place.

I have never tried to become a member of AISSG so I was never turned down. I am not AIS or any of the other conditions for women that you represent. I also don’t care much for the “your still a woman” mantra that constantly gets crammed down your neck. They seam to think that if you tell the lie enough you will start to believe it.

If you don’t like what I write perhaps it is because I am just being honest and realistic. So if you are looking for people to tell you you’re a beautiful woman rather than the truth that you are not much better than the average Halloween drag queen well that’s your choice. I prefer the truth and honesty and I always speak the truth whether it’s popular or not. I also don’t like discrimination and I will stand up against it. And I still think it’s wrong that you offer nothing for the men.

Also to clarify my earlier post in this thread. Being that the only condition that I have been given is male pseudo hermaphrodite and not AIS or CAH or any of the others because I don’t fit the body parts list or have the symptoms of the other conditions It’s folks like the AISSG that are forcing all the issues and forcing all the decisions but not representing everyone that is effected by your changes. So I don’t care to be represented within the medical and intersex community by people that discriminate against their own.

That’s my opinion whether you like it or not.

[Sunshine1]

Hi Dana!








Aimee

[Sunshine1]

I don't post much anymore but it was good to see you responded as well.

I've learned a lot from what you've written and thank you for being you.

Aimee

[Dana Gold]

Hi Aimee!! Thanks for the kind words. We all learn from each other, you've contributed as well. Take care.

Dana

[Priestess]

Miriam,
That's okay, I'm not angry with you, and I'm only partly-frustrated with the AIS groups. I realize the members have their own concerns. I'm only upset with the situation I'm in, where there seems to be nobody who doesn't disavow me.

And I don't think I would have said to you or any other AIS'er some of the things that princess said. Regardless of how similar our conditions may or may not be, I find I can't quite agree with her when she said how everyone who sets off y-detection must be drag queens. I guess she might feel like someone stole her manhood, which is understandable I suppose. Just it's not how I feel.

[Dana Gold]

Gee, why would a PAIS man want to be with AIS women when personal issues are going to be sooooo different? If I would have the wont to participate in personal support group dynamics then I'd go to where the similarities outweigh the differences....and a men's group? for those with my condition....hah!...no way, Jose!! Do I want to be part of a gathering ...where they would be chattering men's stuff and focusing on men's issues??

Would men know about and/or could relate to women's issues or .....women about men's....it's only practical...and common sense.

Sometimes the same umbrella (as in an umbrella term IS, DSD, CAH etc) can block out the sun as well as the rain.....not all within the same label are going to feel comfortable or get the support they need; the individual/specific differences requiring some to go on to where the same "language" (thoughts/feelings and personal psyche) is "spoken".

PS: since I'm one of those "orphans" who don't have a "ready-freddy"- diagnosis like some here, that hasn't hindered me in interacting with others.....certainly one thing we all can relate to is the experience and reality of being anatomically different from the "normo-sexuals"........don't need a moniker for that.

Dana......hmmm..I like the little twirly thingy that accompanies clicking on Edit...{:>)

[fraulein_Maria]

Originally Posted by prince....ss?

Fraulin Maria,

Bull shit!!!

>>> can you be more specific please? <<<

These support groups are a contact point and an organization. A place of focus so that people that need support can find it.

>>> some are. some aren't. one of the AIS support groups @yahoo.com is open to everyone (i don't have AIS... i asked to join so i could learn about AIS people... the condition itself is no mystery to me) they graceously allowed me in. They have just as graciously allowed PAIS'ers (both male and female identifying) and transgendered MtF folks in.
I wish the owner/moderator (a male doctor who is seemingly impossible to actually reach) took a more active role. Failing that, turn over moderating duties to someone who will actually do the job.
I don't see this as unreasonable. <<<

I don’t have a problem if you want to have a meeting with just young girls with AIS but to say to someone sorry you identify as a man so go fuck yourself is wrong.

>>> I never said, nor i believe, did i imply such a thing. the fact is, the MtF trangendered identify as female not male, so i really don't know where any of this is coming from. <<<

AISSG should have a place for the men that have AIS, a common but separate place.

>>> it was my understanding that it did. should that not be so however, there is nothing to stop men with AIS from starting there own group. <<<

BLO can support many intersex conditions, why can’t they support one of their own!!!

>>> princess, what do you need? i mean really?

As several BLO members can attest, i have been there for them. And my assistance is not simply electronic. for privacy's sake, i can't be specific, but understand that i'm a most resourceful person. Think of me as RADAR O'Reilly of MASH. If i don't have it, i know someone who does, and i can get them to sell or trade for it.